Inception discussion thread

[Nemo]

i read through all this and

 

 

this is bull sh*t. imma gonna go and watch me some transformers 2, where machines go BOOM and chicks have boobs and life is much simpler

 

no. not really.. but i am really confused about inception now, had a nice clear ending in mind once i exited the hall, thanks a lot guys

 

[Madhav]

i read through all this and

 

 

this is bull sh*t. imma gonna go and watch me some transformers 2, where machines go BOOM and chicks have boobs and life is much simpler

 

no. not really.. but i am really confused about inception now, had a nice clear ending in mind once i exited the hall, thanks a lot guys

 

 

/that reaction!

 

a handful of laughter in the morning is good. Sir, Thank yu for that!

[Madhav]

I want to change my vote. What is the procedure?

[Nemo]

i have a strange thought.. what if we all are in a dream and Chris Nolan pulled the biggest inception on us o_0

i mean he made us think and think and think about the movie now has not he

 

i think the more and more i think about it, i would end up in a straight jacket

[Madhav]

i have a strange thought.. what if we all are in a dream and Chris Nolan pulled the biggest inception on us o_0

i mean he made us think and think and think about the movie now has not he

 

i think the more and more i think about it, i would end up in a straight jacket

lol.. I've heard this alot of times now and it seems so bloody true... I have never ever seen sooooooooo many people watching a movie multiple-times (i.e. more than once.. Atleast!) in movie theaters!!

 

Its Christopher Nolan who pulled an Inception on the viewers, a f**ckin brilliant one!

[Nemo]

that also meant that more and more people will go for multiple viewings.. more $$$ for Nolan.

man, one sneaky bastid he is... :bravo:

[Madhav]

that also meant that more and more people will go for multiple viewings.. more $$$ for Nolan.

man, one sneaky bastid he is... :bravo:

Bingo! Hence, the reason to pull of such an Inception!

[sup bro?]

This, plus, the old Saito also handled the spinning 'totem' top in the beginning... Also, from what i understood about totem is that it lets yu differentiate whether yu are in reality or in the dream of someone else... Now, what if yu are in your own dream (where yu are the dreamer and yu are the architect)? Once yu are in your own dream, you know your totem and sub-consciously yu can control it... Its like telling yu not to think of elephants, but yu think of elephants... So, yu tell yourself its a real world, but to check yu use yur totem and yur totem behaves as it should in the real world as you sub-consciously know/think that!

 

That's what I meant to say a couple of pages back.

 

The point is, Nolan has left specific clues for everyone with a theory. Cobb can be in a dream or he can be in reality. I read another theory which said that till Mombasa, Cobb is in reality. But when he enters the shared dream space in Yusuf's basement along with the other 'addicts' he remains there and cooks up the rest of the movie.

 

Also, didn't Caine (grandfather) said he will be heading to the US when Cobb gives him those presents to hand over to his kids??? Maybe that's why he was at the airport.

[Madhav]

That's what I meant to say a couple of pages back.

 

The point is, Nolan has left specific clues for everyone with a theory. Cobb can be in a dream or he can be in reality. I read another theory which said that till Mombasa, Cobb is in reality. But when he enters the shared dream space in Yusuf's basement along with the other 'addicts' he remains there and cooks up the rest of the movie.

Even the Mombasa chase sequence and Saito rescuing him seems very dream-like and this happens before he enters the basement of yusef!!

Also, it just occured to me.... The old keeper/watchman in Yusef's basement tells Cobb that, "these addicts don't come here to dream, they come here to be woken up! And, who better than you to know that!!".... Faaaaaaak... Clear implication of Cobb being an addict once and that old keeper must have known him from his days of "being woken up"....The theory yu read makes sense

 

Also, didn't Caine (grandfather) said he will be heading to the US when Cobb gives him those presents to hand over to his kids??? Maybe that's why he was at the airport.

but granny??

[Madhav]

Even the Mombasa chase sequence and Saito rescuing him seems very dream-like and this happens before he enters the basement of yusef!!

Also, it just occured to me.... The old keeper/watchman in Yusef's basement tells Cobb that, "these addicts don't come here to dream, they come here to be woken up! And, who better than you to know that!!".... Faaaaaaak... Clear implication of Cobb being an addict once and that old keeper must have known him from his days of "being woken up"....The theory yu read makes sense

 

EDIT: But, on the flipside, its clearly mentioned in the movie that Cobb cant dream anymore (as he was sharing the dream-space with other dream addicts, w/o the dream machine).. Hence, his weird dream (Memories.flashbacks relating Mal, train etc) and he instantly snaps out of it...

 

*mind-rape*

[sup bro?]

Assuming he was in a dream during Mombasa chase.

 

Another thing, in Mombasa, why were the projections from his own mind chasing him. Aren't they supposed to invade any outsiders who manipulate the dreamspace??

 

Counter point - Let's say those projections were Cobb's subconscience acting up on him because he had a *guilt* of letting Mal die.

 

Counter Counter point - Why were only a few selected people in the crowd attacking him while the rest were spectators?? When Ariadne invades Cobb's dream and starts cookig sh*t up by doing all sorts of mindbending stuff each and every projection looks at her as if she is hostile.

 

 

Fun fact - Ariadne (whose name they derive from Hesychius' listing of Άδνον, a Cretan-Greek form for arihagne, "utterly pure") was a Great Goddess of Crete, "the first divine personage of Greek mythology to be immediately recognized in Crete",[7] once archaeology had begun. Kerenyi observes that her name is merely an epithet and claims that she was originally the "Mistress of the Labyrinth", both a winding dance-ground and in the Greek view a prison with the dreaded Minotaur at its centre.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ariadne

 

 

 

 

Question - What was her totem??? Was it a bishop???

[Bulovski]

Maybe Cobb was in reality till the point he goes in Limbo again. He's realized that Saito dying means there's no way he can get back to his children. So he constructs another dream where everything works out - he exorcises Mal because Ariadne kills her, the inception works on the mark, and he's allowed to enter the US to see his children. He uses Saito's old image as his false 'kick' - to get out of limbo into another dream where everything is ok - and that's why the top keeps spinning.

[sup bro?]

Shaktiman claimed a lot of lives during its stint on National Television. I'm wondering if Inception will make headlines for all the wrong reasons.

[achilles]

hmm..let's go over these..s.l.o.w.l.y. :

 

@achilles - quoting you here instead of the movie discussion thread for very obvious reasons...

 

 

i know dude!

 

the more i think, the more it seems like the end scene was a dream... These points ---> Phillipa's voice on phone, Miles using the words "Come back to reality Dom!" (When he tells him about Mal is not letting him architect dreams), Mombasa - very dreamy chase.. having a maze like quality to it (escaping wall-gap, Saito's presence, etc), absence of grand-mother but presence of grand-father in the end (Miles was a college professor in Paris? yet he is found welcoming Cobb in America), Cobb coming home through the similar elevator "prison of his memory" entrance, kids sitting/playing in the same way(with same clothes) even during the end scene/supposed reality... i don't know where to end...

Another very important pointer is Cobb's refusal to look at his children's faces.... Possibly since he remembers his kids faces and doesn't want to look at them in a dreamworld as it'll make him believe that its reality instead of dream (totem reference anyone??)

 

we're gonna check for the conclusiveness of the dream state :

 

1. we gotta check for Phillipa's voice on the phone. even then if she sounds conclusively older, it's not conclusive. she could just be a child with mature voice . and if it is, then atleast some of the movie is in the real world. the totem falls in that scene. so the totem falls in the real world, as his subconscious can't keep it spinning in the real world.

2. dreamy chase..well credit to the creativity of the screenplay writer, the director and the cameraman. not conclusive that it was a dream. saito's presence.. movie coolness factor increase..non conclusive again.

3. absence of grand mother..she's in the washroom or sick or dead or gone grocery shopping. whatever. non conclusive

4. grandfather had to go to the US anyway. he said that in a dialog with Cobb.

5. paris has colleges y'no..they're not dumb high schoolers, all of them

6. similar elevator..well duh..he was using his memories in his dreams.

7. the kids being the same nad everything..can be attributed to cinematic liberty..Nolan wanted to show the relief Cobb would feel when he actually does see their faces. still..this is the most valid and the strongest point out of all. we'll tuck this in for a bit.

 

After such brainstorming, this is what i get in my mail from a friend...

 

we'll deconstruct this separately

 

All this has definitely inclined my perception of INCEPTION as being Cobb's dreamworld in the end!!

I really do have to go for a 3rd show now, but this time, as a person who doesn't want to give a f**k whether the end world is a reality/dream/limbo/etc.

 

then what's the point of the third show? ha!

 

The most intriguing perspective to this movie is it's AMBIGUITY!!! I believe anything is possible. It is up to the viewer to decided it for himself, everytime he watches this movie... Its like a drug, yu just cant watch this once. Period!

 

yep. the ambiguity. it can be as simple as you want it to be. and as complex as it wants to be. deeper and deeper down the rabbit hole

[achilles]

This, plus, the old Saito also handled the spinning 'totem' top in the beginning...

 

dammit i missed this. i def need to watch it again.

 

Also, from what i understood about totem is that it lets yu differentiate whether yu are in reality or in the dream of someone else... Now, what if yu are in your own dream (where yu are the dreamer and yu are the architect)? Once yu are in your own dream, you know your totem and sub-consciously yu can control it... Its like telling yu not to think of elephants, but yu think of elephants... So, yu tell yourself its a real world, but to check yu use yur totem and yur totem behaves as it should in the real world as you sub-consciously know/think that!

 

i think the point of the totem was that you try to make it behave the way you want it to. if it follows the laws of the real world (top falling etc.), you're in the real world. but then, that could be attributed to any object in the dream world. why'd you need a totem for that? just to keep a differentiating factor?

 

but it could also happen that when your subconscious believes that you're in the real world, it would make sure the top falls. /FFS

 

During the times Cobb's totem topples ---> Cobb always knew sub-consciously that he is in the real world, but to check he spun... and it toppled! Never was he shown spinning in dreamworld.

 

yep. he dint actually spin it in the dream world except for while incepting Mal now did he?

 

During the end scene ----> His totem would have toppled had his concentration stayed on totem, but on the contrary Mr. Miles distracted him by pointing towards his children who showed him their faces and Cobb forgot about the top instantaneously, and it spun and spun!! Culprit, Mr. Miles..??.. Ariadne was introduced to Cobb by him and she did pose as Cobb's saviour, a Messiah for him!!

 

did i make some sense??

 

yea..but if it was all a dream then Miles was Cobb's own subconscious. how would Cobb know that Miles knew Ariadne?

[achilles]

..

[achilles]

See another hypothesis could be that... When Cobb was telling Ariadne about all that in the 1st dream level, it was Ariadne who was imagining Cobb and Mal to be lying on rail-tracks (Cobb was narrating and she was imagining) and at that time, Ariadne didn't knew about them growing old together in limbo... It was only unraveled in the end...

 

mm..possible.

 

Considering that Mal did wake up somewhere, Cobb was still in some deep sub-conscious level/ dream of his... and Cobb might have been heavily sedated going into that kind of sub-conscious level/limbo that Dom went with Mal.. So, Mal just couldn't wake him up by slapping, etc... She had to have given him a kick.. Now, the duration it took for Mal to arrange a kick for Cobb, we saw the events of Inception! (time relativity as go deep, minutes turn into hours, hours into days, days into years and decades )

 

again..possible..but that's not what the movie hinted at all. we have to let go of scenarios that the movie does not hint even at all. like the end being Miles' dream. i mean WTF. as if we don't have enough to crap ourselves about :\

 

That's what I meant to say a couple of pages back.

 

The point is, Nolan has left specific clues for everyone with a theory. Cobb can be in a dream or he can be in reality. I read another theory which said that till Mombasa, Cobb is in reality. But when he enters the shared dream space in Yusuf's basement along with the other 'addicts' he remains there and cooks up the rest of the movie.

 

Also, didn't Caine (grandfather) said he will be heading to the US when Cobb gives him those presents to hand over to his kids??? Maybe that's why he was at the airport.

 

yep..he could've stayed in Mombasa..and if he did i'm sure we wuda seen much better clues or direct show about that in the movie. we gotta let go of scenarios which were against the general direction of the movie. just for this argument. don't let them go for general discussion. it's everyone's own interpretation

 

Even the Mombasa chase sequence and Saito rescuing him seems very dream-like and this happens before he enters the basement of yusef!!

Also, it just occured to me.... The old keeper/watchman in Yusef's basement tells Cobb that, "these addicts don't come here to dream, they come here to be woken up! And, who better than you to know that!!".... Faaaaaaak... Clear implication of Cobb being an addict once and that old keeper must have known him from his days of "being woken up"....The theory yu read makes sense

 

 

but granny??

 

they come here to be woken up cz they live for weeks in the dream world by dreaming for a few (4?) hours in the real world. they still live out their real lives.

 

the granny was taking a nap when Cobb came

 

 

 

 

 

 

had to go the multiple reply route as it's not allowing me to post with more than 5 quoted conversations :|

[Nemo]

dp..

[Nemo]

I really refuse to accept the "It was all a dream theory" simply because if that is the case then is movie is garbage.. its very easy to show all kinds of batshit insane things and then close it with.. it was all a dream.. Booyeah bitches !!

 

That is the worst kind of ending ever cause you can just keep on piling one nonsense over another without any relation because, well it was all a dream.

 

I really hope that is not the case here, i would lose a lot of respect for nolan if its revealed that this is the real ending.

 

 

 

 

 

Acc. to me, its either

 

1) happy ending, cobb goes to US with his little tykes, everything is fine and all and has a badass story to tell his grandkids.

 

or

 

2) cobb is trapped in the limbo, saito probably killed him in limbo (maybe with cobb's consent) and the new world (shown at the end) is probably what cobb created. I really wonder why it is that only saito and cobb wake up with wtf !! on their faces in the plane, rest all were fine and happy.

 

I need to see the movie again, i really do.

[Nemo]

 

 

 

 

i think the point of the totem was that you try to make it behave the way you want it to. if it follows the laws of the real world (top falling etc.), you're in the real world. but then, that could be attributed to any object in the dream world. why'd you need a totem for that? just to keep a differentiating factor?

 

but it could also happen that when your subconscious believes that you're in the real world, it would make sure the top falls. /FFS

 

 

as per me the totem is what tell the owner if he/she is in a dream or not. like paige at the beginning with di caprio did not know she is in a dream til he told her. throughout the movie di caprio was spinning the top to ascertain he is dreaming or is he in reality. cillian murphy for example was forceably brought in the dream land, he had no clue till Mr. charles told him, had murphy had his totem with himself, he could have checked if he was in a dream the moment he noticed something suspicious.

 

so totem did that only, once if you are brought in dreams without you knowing, you could always check for yourself and try escaping the dream if sinister motives are involved.

 

if however the same person is the creator and the dreamer then of course the totem will be useless but if this is the case then there is no danger, as is there no use for totem.. ie its a normal dream, no one is trying to steal memories or planing inception on the person in question.

 

as for checking the same thing using any object, well i think its cause that only the architect can screw around with the stuff in the dreams, not anyone and everyone that is dreaming. totem had one special characteristic, known to its owner only, like aurther had his (loaded ?) die, paige's chess rook had abnormal center of gravity (we saw her creating it herself), those physical properties will be only known to the owner and the dream creator wont be able to replicate them in dreams.