Bird Bird Bird Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 @motabhai..and yea one thing i can add on what i said..maybe work culture of bengal can be a reason too...on the pathetic state of affairs in even the best hospitals here...because of all the helpful doctors who were so good and excellent were from the south ...its was just amazing to see their way of approach Work culture makes a huge difference. South Indian nurses and docs are more approachable as they are in general more educated than other parts of India. And because of that they still have a sense of compassion in them, which honestly seems to be lost in so many people from northern India. :| Not all doctors perform Life saving surgeries all the time . Thats just the general perception of the people . There are a zillion other things they do normal routine tests , checkups . They are professionals . I never said that if they wanted to earn money they should have taken another route . What I am saying is doctors do earn handsomely once they finish with their education which is a long time compared to other streams where people are settled as soon as you complecte under grad . MBBS ( 5 and half years ) + MD (another 2 years ) + superspeciality ( another year maybe 2 depends as far my bro tells me ) course which is what has been so common nowdays . If a person gets through this he/she is bound to earn well And frankly for that much amt of hard work over that period of time he/she deserves too . True that. And the scenario you said (5+2+2) is the minimum amount of time if all goes well (i.e. without any year loss in between) which is hardly the case unless you have loads of cash/you are a doctor's son(or daughter). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vip3r Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) Agree to this. For a simple example, think about CMC, Vellore. Again one of the most respected institutes in India. They have exactly 5 seats for general people who are not Christians. 5. That's it. So getting in is definitely very very tough. Even I gave the MBBS exam for it back in 2003 and wasn't selected. But a couple of years down the line I met one of my fellow school friend who was studying @ CMC. I was kinda surprised as it's a very hard nut to crack. He bluntly told me they had asked for 25 odd lacs as a donation. And remember that was in 2003. On a much recent note, the going rate for an Anesthesia degree from PGI Chandigarh is around 1.25 crores and that's barring the fees. Orthopaedics, Radio-diagnosis, Paediatrics etc. fields go for anything between 50 lacs (for unrecognised colleges) to 1 crore (for recognised ones). Eve an Ortho diploma is costing 49 lacs now-a-days. Just thin about the level of corruption in the field. And if you guys think these rates are a deterrent, think again. The rates are this sky high because people are able to pay that much. Many of my friends had seats ready for them in various south indian colleges even before they completed their internship. Ready on a plate. It's so f**king sick I can keep on ranting about it. DMRD anyday if he has a settled background for Radiology. Insane amount of income. Good that somebody realised it's not that easy for us lot. 48 hour duties are normal. 24 hour duties are normal. f**ked up lab reports are normal. People bickering at us are normal. Trying to save a life and still getting beaten is normal. But I still love it It's damn exciting ! +100000000000 Doctory ko alu sabzi bana dia hai and I would like to add to this point and say taht I know people who are not paying this fee themselves but on the contrary they are forcing the family whose daughter he has promised to marry sad but true also repped dinjo Edited March 8, 2011 by Vip3r Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 +100000000000 Doctory ko alu sabzi bana dia hai and I would like to add to this point and say taht I know people who are not paying this fee themselves but on the contrary they are forcing the family whose daughter he has promised to marry sad but true South Indians > Bihar > UP. I know. Same profession ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersim Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) Work culture makes a huge difference. South Indian nurses and docs are more approachable as they are in general more educated than other parts of India. And because of that they still have a sense of compassion in them, which honestly seems to be lost in so many people from northern India. :| True that. And the scenario you said (5+2+2) is the minimum amount of time if all goes well (i.e. without any year loss in between) which is hardly the case unless you have loads of cash/you are a doctor's son(or daughter). oops my bad . Yeah keep dropping if you cant pay a bomb of a donation . PS - One of the reasons why my parents (both docs ) said not to take up medical Shadi , bache sab ho jate padhai tab bhi chal rahi hoti Edited March 8, 2011 by supersim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vip3r Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 oops my bad . Yeah keep dropping if you cant pay a bomb of a donation . PS - One of the reasons why my parents (both docs ) said not to take up medical Shadi , bache sab ho jate padhai tab bhi chal rahi hoti Aur pata chala ki beta suhag rat ke din mota kitabein lekar sar patak raha hai Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitaire Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Doctors can earn a lot if they want to . I know doctors who earn a lot . I mean a lot There is always a shortage of doctors somewhere or the other . Imho they work 10x times harder than engineers , they deserve to earn more They can. Which is what I'm saying. You'd however be surprised at the specific doctors who earn more than some really really hardworking ones who actually deserve to. Merely cos they have the right connections / bribe the right receptionist / manager / other doctor to get more patients. There are several ways of earning and the specific ways being used more and more these days send chills down my spine when I hear about them. There are corporate hospitals who give a damn about whether the patient actually needs surgery. All they care about is "quota". Certain number of cases in certain number of days. Theater time division is done on the basis of who has more clout with the management. It's not what it was twenty years ago. Doctors are not professionals but they provide a kind of service that makes people to equate them with God and nothing less. The kind of respect they get can never be compared to engineers but saying that if they wanted to earn money they should have taken another route as per their careers. Money per se is not bad but greed associated with it is Agreed. But that is decreasing day by day. It is obvious how they are seen more as a business than as "next to God" by most people in modern times. And it's especially because of the kind of money many of them earn through numerous means - some legit and some quite unethical. IF that blind faith in a doctor was still there, they wouldn't come into your OP and ask you for this procedure to be done on this specific part of the body Yeah, you'd be surprised how people look up things on the web and decide all by themselves what exactly ails them. Dad usually starts off with "Have you been in medicine for more than twenty years or have I? " and that shuts them up. Then there are all those people going to ask for second (and sometimes third) opinions until they decide on whichever suits THEM best, the one THEY think is what's right. If that faith was there in doctors, they wouldn't sue them for negligence (I'm talking about cases well beyond the control of the doctor to assure recovery) for a patient's death. What I am saying is doctors do earn handsomely once they finish with their education which is a long time compared to other streams where people are settled as soon as you complecte under grad . MBBS ( 5 and half years ) + MD (another 2 years ) + superspeciality ( another year maybe 2 depends as far my bro tells me ) course which is what has been so common nowdays . If a person gets through this he/she is bound to earn well And frankly for that much amt of hard work over that period of time he/she deserves too . Like you said. MBBS+MD/MS (if surgery) + Superspecialization. It's pretty much a minimum nowadays. And yeah, by the time they start earning they're much older than other professionals. So they do deserve to earn well for all the trouble - mental and otherwise they undergo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitaire Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Agree to this. For a simple example, think about CMC, Vellore. Again one of the most respected institutes in India. They have exactly 5 seats for general people who are not Christians. 5. That's it. So getting in is definitely very very tough. Even I gave the MBBS exam for it back in 2003 and wasn't selected. But a couple of years down the line I met one of my fellow school friend who was studying @ CMC. I was kinda surprised as it's a very hard nut to crack. He bluntly told me they had asked for 25 odd lacs as a donation. And remember that was in 2003. On a much recent note, the going rate for an Anesthesia degree from PGI Chandigarh is around 1.25 crores and that's barring the fees. Orthopaedics, Radio-diagnosis, Paediatrics etc. fields go for anything between 50 lacs (for unrecognised colleges) to 1 crore (for recognised ones). Eve an Ortho diploma is costing 49 lacs now-a-days. Just thin about the level of corruption in the field. And if you guys think these rates are a deterrent, think again. The rates are this sky high because people are able to pay that much. Many of my friends had seats ready for them in various south indian colleges even before they completed their internship. Ready on a plate. It's so f**king sick I can keep on ranting about it. Good that somebody realised it's not that easy for us lot. 48 hour duties are normal. 24 hour duties are normal. f**ked up lab reports are normal. People bickering at us are normal. Trying to save a life and still getting beaten is normal. But I still love it It's damn exciting ! THIS. They respect you when all goes well and treat you like God. Especially the families from more rural areas. In cities they're like "We pay big so get it done" sometimes. I'd definitely have liked the challenge of a medical career. But honestly it was hearing my dad talk about all the things such a career would involve (coupled with my "quest for a BMW M3/M5" ) that prompted me to drop the medical line. Besides we don't have a separate clinic or hospital of our own, so it's not like I'm gonna make back an investment that big (assuming I couldn't get into the best of the best colleges, though I suppose I may just have .. who knows). Like fatty says, people are paying that much for "prestige" even people I know who pay it for their daughters, then daughter gets married off right after a single degree and doesn't work much. Like f**k man, that's just crazy. Ramachandra college here in Chennai provides package deals going for a few crores. 3 degrees continuous whether you pass the finals or not (as in they "make sure" you pass ). And these people then work in major hospitals here and across India. No matter how rich an individual or how poor, if you dole out that much dough, you're definitely thinking about making it back and you'll take a route that best serves that interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DinJo Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 I need to get out of my job asap but the fookers have delayed increment and bonus to May.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vip3r Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Agreed. But that is decreasing day by day. It is obvious how they are seen more as a business than as "next to God" by most people in modern times. And it's especially because of the kind of money many of them earn through numerous means - some legit and some quite unethical. IF that blind faith in a doctor was still there, they wouldn't come into your OP and ask you for this procedure to be done on this specific part of the body Yeah, you'd be surprised how people look up things on the web and decide all by themselves what exactly ails them. Dad usually starts off with "Have you been in medicine for more than twenty years or have I? " and that shuts them up. Then there are all those people going to ask for second (and sometimes third) opinions until they decide on whichever suits THEM best, the one THEY think is what's right. If that faith was there in doctors, they wouldn't sue them for negligence (I'm talking about cases well beyond the control of the doctor to assure recovery) for a patient's death. Like you said. MBBS+MD/MS (if surgery) + Superspecialization. It's pretty much a minimum nowadays. And yeah, by the time they start earning they're much older than other professionals. So they do deserve to earn well for all the trouble - mental and otherwise they undergo. You are talking about a demographic that is really very miniscule when compared to India's health needs. People in the rural or even cities like kolkata don't know how to move a mouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Agreed. But that is decreasing day by day. It is obvious how they are seen more as a business than as "next to God" by most people in modern times. And it's especially because of the kind of money many of them earn through numerous means - some legit and some quite unethical. IF that blind faith in a doctor was still there, they wouldn't come into your OP and ask you for this procedure to be done on this specific part of the body Yeah, you'd be surprised how people look up things on the web and decide all by themselves what exactly ails them. Dad usually starts off with "Have you been in medicine for more than twenty years or have I? " and that shuts them up. Then there are all those people going to ask for second (and sometimes third) opinions until they decide on whichever suits THEM best, the one THEY think is what's right. If that faith was there in doctors, they wouldn't sue them for negligence (I'm talking about cases well beyond the control of the doctor to assure recovery) for a patient's death. True this. So many people and I mean MANY read up things on the net, specially the 'health' sites & wikipedia and then come questioning on why is this needed and this will cause this side effect etc etc. And trust me if you are in private practice you WILL have to CONVINCE them in a professional manner else there goes your patient :| I think MCI should start accepting Wikipedia readers as GPs nowadays. Who would study 10 years of his life when Wiki is there ! :| THIS. They respect you when all goes well and treat you like God. Especially the families from more rural areas. In cities they're like "We pay big so get it done" sometimes. Heh. The best part is every move you do is questioned. It's like explaining them what you have learned in 10 years in 10 mins. :| And if any patient dies in Emergency the doc on duty is so screwed. Specially if it's after giving an injection. People will go any lengths just to prove that particular injection was the cause the patient died. :| Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitaire Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 You are talking about a demographic that is really very miniscule when compared to India's health needs. People in the rural or even cities like kolkata don't know how to move a mouse Which is the demographic to be concerned with when talking about doctors who earn SOOOOO much. The majority of India's doctors concentrate on getting a job within the cities post their numerous degrees. Otherwise they wouldn't have tried to get more people into government hospitals in rural areas by trying to introduce that compulsory 1 year rural internship before graduation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sufyan Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 True this. So many people and I mean MANY read up things on the net, specially the 'health' sites & wikipedia and then come questioning on why is this needed and this will cause this side effect etc etc. And trust me if you are in private practice you WILL have to CONVINCE them in a professional manner else there goes your patient :| I think MCI should start accepting Wikipedia readers as GPs nowadays. Who would study 10 years of his life when Wiki is there ! :| Heh. The best part is every move you do is questioned. It's like explaining them what you have learned in 10 years in 10 mins. :| And if any patient dies in Emergency the doc on duty is so screwed. Specially if it's after giving an injection. People will go any lengths just to prove that particular injection was the cause the patient died. :| right now i am very disillusioned with my career.have to do 72 hrs call during major postings and i am supposed to get a stipend of 1500 rs every month which i havent got till date even once.Very little hope of getting pg seat compounded by parental pressure Feel like quitting studying any further. regarding your lat sentence,A cobra bite case once came to the hospital during my rural posting,atleast 20 people were accompanying him.The patient died and i got scared that the mob would beat me up coz i was treating him at the time.I informed the senior doctor about it and he told me to keep giving chest compressions even though the patient had passed away,so i kept doing it for 45 mins so i could convince the relatives that i tried my best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 72 hours postings. f**k I would have kicked the consultant on duty on his a*s ! Done a max of 48 hours with a half day for the next day. :| Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersim Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 sufi hang in there bro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killzone123 Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 ^^^ +1 seriously we need nice guys like you and motabhai to be doctors...in the long run i am sure people like you can help quite a number Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitaire Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) regarding your lat sentence,A cobra bite case once came to the hospital during my rural posting,atleast 20 people were accompanying him.The patient died and i got scared that the mob would beat me up coz i was treating him at the time.I informed the senior doctor about it and he told me to keep giving chest compressions even though the patient had passed away,so i kept doing it for 45 mins so i could convince the relatives that i tried my best sh*t now that's a scary experience us engineering people will never have. Now I understand what the gf says when she talks internship this posting that.. difficulty.. blah blah blah I'd honestly have been sweating buckets in your situation. You know, when I think about somewhat uneducated patients and doctors having to deal with them, this is one joke I remember: Joe and Jim were out cutting wood, and Jim cut his arm off. Joe wrapped the arm in a plastic bag and took Jim to a surgeon. The surgeon said “You’re lucky! I’m expert at reattaching limbs! Come back in 5 hours.” So Joe left and when he returned in 5 hours the surgeon said “I got done quicker than I expected. Jim is down at the pub.” Joe went to he pub and there was Jim, throwing darts. A few weeks later, Joe and Jim were cutting wood again, and Jim cut his leg off. Joe put the leg in a plastic bag and took it and Jim back to the surgeon. The surgeon said “No problem, but legs are a little tougher. Come back in 8 hours.” Joe left and when he came back in 8 hours the surgeon said “I finished early, Jim’s down at the soccer field.” Joe went down to the soccer field and there was Jim, kicking goals. A few weeks later, Jim had a terrible accident and cut his head off. Joe put the head in a plastic bag and took it and the rest of Jim to the surgeon. The surgeon looked at the situation and said “God, heads are really tough. Come back in12 hours.” So Joe left and when he returned in twelve hours the surgeon said regretfully “I’m sorry, Jim died.” Joe said “I understand – heads are really tough.” The surgeon said, “Oh no! The surgery went fine! Jim suffocated in that plastic bag! I hear each and every night my Dad on the phone trying to answer patients' queries and tell them the medicines they must take. No matter how many times you tell them some retards will call without the prescription near them. Then when he asks them what medicines they're taking they'll go "Jo medicine aapne likha vo" When they do call back with prescription in hand they'll have a lot of trouble with the medicine's name. I still go when he dictates "C .... Chennai wala C... M for Meerut... arre bhai aapko M nahin maloom tho mein kya karega?". And there's all those different languages you have to deal with other than Hindi and English - Malayalam, Tamil, Telugu, Oriya, Bangla, Gujarati, Punjabi, Urdu, Arabic, French, Spanish.. even Korean once or twice. And that list is hardly exhaustive. Frankly so much work goes into just communicating with a patient well . Doctors definitely deserve an award for the trouble it takes to maintain a practice. sh*t, if a patient kept acting like a retard over the phone a few times, I'd just blow my top and give him a piece of my mind. Edited March 8, 2011 by Gaurav - Solitaire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sufyan Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 Thanks simmy,obaid bhai I will keep fighting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killzone123 Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 . M for Meerut... arre bhai aapko M nahin maloom tho mein kya karega?". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vip3r Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) Which is the demographic to be concerned with when talking about doctors who earn SOOOOO much. The majority of India's doctors concentrate on getting a job within the cities post their numerous degrees. Otherwise they wouldn't have tried to get more people into government hospitals in rural areas by trying to introduce that compulsory 1 year rural internship before graduation. Are you simply assuming that there is no poverty in the urban areas? Respect for mota and obaid bhai in other words you rock Edited March 8, 2011 by Vip3r Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avkash Posted March 10, 2011 Report Share Posted March 10, 2011 (edited) i chose engineering over medicine because in medicine i would have to work doubly harder for double the duration to earn lesser than what I would start at after doing engineering with almost non existent effort in only 4 years My wife is a doctor and I see it first hand how sad is that state of the profession right now. like somebody told earlier, it is almost impossible to convince the rural people that somebody has died because of reasons outside of a doctors control. and even she tells me of scenarios when they too did chest pumping to ensure the relatives that they tried, this is a common alibi i guess And the amount of donations that prevail to get a seat in any college (really ANY collage in ANY city) is preposterous Edited March 10, 2011 by avkash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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