jugaad - or bribing is this good or bad

[The Wolfy among us]

Lol you really have no idea what a family doctor is it?

 

Family doctor is a person who knows your family's medical history. He's supposed to know your genetic problems etc. Not to give you a shortcut into the operation theatre. Also, a family doc is mostly a, general physician. Not a specialist, or a surgeon.

 

And we do have footpaths in India which are overridden by motorcyclists, footpath dwellers, shops, etc. But doesn't mean we don't have them.

 

Again, don't you see the problem here? You are willing to accept the jugaad as a way of life, have learnt to deal with it,and maybe even become an expert at it. This is my biggest problem with India.

 

And my latest irritation, is the jugaad which every little shopkeeper does nowadays. Candy, instead of giving one or two rupee change. Earlier a shopkeeper used to make sure he had change at all times.

 

I used to argue with shopkeepers for this one rupee, but lately I've been given looks from others waiting behind me, so I walk away.

 

I've lost at least 200 bucks this way in the past one year, all thanks to the sandwich place in my office.

[DealinGames]

@ your last reply is awesome...

 

but didnt you ever use jugaad in your life... and did it helped you or not..

 

 

@for change usually i had fight is people in railway station -

 

Its written clearly above every stall give exact amount and when we ask them to give us back they say either get change or do as they say.

 

these people even dont keep chocalates as change. so end user have to pay them extra .

 

but jugaad doest comes help in canteen.

[_Hellsboy_]

okay u meant we delay other work by giving bribe

 

@my store was mentioned earlier.so what should i do police guy is asking either to get police license or pay him 5000 rs .

 

Now dont u peoople think he will delay the license bcz each month he will get 5000rs

 

@just instance of life tells people about what jugaad meant to them..Dont people feel that without jugaad things are not simpler in india and in our busy life dont we wont something to be simple thx

You are not getting my point. One is where you simply cannot escape a bad situation without bribing.

 

And another is when you try to override the official procedure/ cut ahead/ try to gain advantage using jugar. I am talking about the second situation. Things like jumping the line in a govt hospital cos u knw the physician. Things like getting tickets and passes through contacts. Etc etc..

 

I hate people who do the second category of stuff

[Pushy]

Jugaad, is the other name of India

[The Wolfy among us]

Yup there's a book also in it. Jugaad invention. Have been meaning to read it for a while now.

[The Wolfy among us]

You are not getting my point. One is where you simply cannot escape a bad situation without bribing.

 

And another is when you try to override the official procedure/ cut ahead/ try to gain advantage using jugar. I am talking about the second situation. Things like jumping the line in a govt hospital cos u knw the physician. Things like getting tickets and passes through contacts. Etc etc..

 

I hate people who do the second category of stuff

Exactly my point. Let's leave bribery out of the discussion. That needs a vast change in outlook.

 

But these little things drive me up the wall.

 

@coolrocker I've used it in the past when I didn't know better. But once I started working and stayed alone in bangalore started realising the mistake. I've benefited from Jugaad, but I've stopped doing it.

[shekdown]

Its more than just people wanting to jump the queue. Officials refuse to get work done unless you give them an incentive or drop names. Its a terrible state and I wish it would change but I had noted this.

 

During the Anna Hazare protests, when it was in full flow, I supported it entirely. I didnt partake in any activity of bribing or dropping names or neither did any of my friends/colleagues. We urged this behaviour to continue. However, what we noticed was that though the government officials were scared, they refused to do work for anyone. Irrespective of bribe or not. It was literally stand-still. I cannot enunciate the myriad of issues a corporate or a corporate person had to face with government for those 3-4 months.

[Shantz]

^^ Pure BS. We just choose to believe that nothing can be done without bribes because the officials delay by a few days and we tow the line. Many times they don't even need to delay but just hint that they will.

 

I have not paid even a single rupee of bribe for any of my govt. related work in the last 7 years.

 

Edit: Just wanted to mention that I come from a very simple family. No "back", no big names, no politician, no policemen, no money, nothing.

[Nemo]

Its more than just people wanting to jump the queue. Officials refuse to get work done unless you give them an incentive or drop names. Its a terrible state and I wish it would change but I had noted this.

 

During the Anna Hazare protests, when it was in full flow, I supported it entirely. I didnt partake in any activity of bribing or dropping names or neither did any of my friends/colleagues. We urged this behaviour to continue. However, what we noticed was that though the government officials were scared, they refused to do work for anyone. Irrespective of bribe or not. It was literally stand-still. I cannot enunciate the myriad of issues a corporate or a corporate person had to face with government for those 3-4 months.

 

 

ummm... that was precisely because they were scared. For a period around the circus when it was at its hype, most government departments became overly cautious in clearing any file or proposal lest hazare or any zealot associated with him conjure up the vaguest of connection between the particular officer and the deal if it happens to go wrong at any stage, irrespective of the said officer or department's involvement in any grafting. The anti corruption laws are such that anyone can use it against any govt officer if he has an involvement, how so ever benign, in any deal that can be proven to have benefitted a private entity in an unscrupulous manner. Does not take a genius to figure out how some one with backing of misguided altruistic principles can use the emotional wave to settle personal scores.

 

It is not just me but also an unofficial corporate mouthpiece that is saying it: http://www.business-standard.com/article/opinion/a-k-bhattacharya-the-hazare-fall-out-111041200034_1.html

 

 

I am in no way advocating legitimacy of bribing, but what happened during hazare overdose was quite different.

[Man In The Box]

People who pay bribes are not doing anything wrong. If someone is accepting it and it helps get the job done faster, then why not? Only the people that accept bribes are the ones that should be blamed.

 

e.g. If you get stopped for overspeeding, you are doing nothing wrong by paying Rs. 100 to get away with the crime. The police who accept the bribe are the only ones at fault.

[Nemo]

what an a*s backward sense of logic

an acceptable, even encouraged readiness to pay bribe is as much an illegal act as accepting it.

[The Wolfy among us]

People who pay bribes are not doing anything wrong. If someone is accepting it and it helps get the job done faster, then why not? Only the people that accept bribes are the ones that should be blamed.

 

e.g. If you get stopped for overspeeding, you are doing nothing wrong by paying Rs. 100 to get away with the crime. The police who accept the bribe are the only ones at fault.

You're not aware of the fact that paying a bribe is also against the law is procecutable?

 

Besides so bribes can be rampant, and people who cannot afford the bribe be damned?

 

a*s backward indeed!

[Bird Bird Bird]

People who pay bribes are not doing anything wrong. If someone is accepting it and it helps get the job done faster, then why not? Only the people that accept bribes are the ones that should be blamed.

e.g. If you get stopped for overspeeding, you are doing nothing wrong by paying Rs. 100 to get away with the crime. The police who accept the bribe are the only ones at fault.

http://www.ibtl.in/column/1368/the-30-billion-dollar-medical-seats-scam

 

Yes saar, nothing wrong with it. Don't cry foul when the next time you visit a hospital, they actually take out your kidneys.

[Spacescreamer]

Don't cry foul when the next time you visit a hospital, they actually take out your kidneys.

 

Look for the nameplate.. something like 'B3 ji' should raise the hackles.

 

 

On a serious note,

Why dont we have a poll attached to this topic ??

 

 

A friend of mine during the college days used to be regular in my group.

We once went to take lunch in a decent food joint, and i asked him what kind of food would he prefer (i meant to ask the cuisine)

 

His instant reply: Muft ka!

And his daddy was... guess n wait for it.. A Policeman!

[Ne0]

Bribing is bad,its a social evil, there's no defense there. But sometimes one gotta do it in a country like India, simply because of the lack of other alternatives. Not everyone has the time to sit for a dharna in front of the office or go on a hunger strike demanding justice. Nobody would want to give a bribe , who wants to waste their hard earned money ? Normal middle class person has a day job to attend to, families to feed.

 

When you go to the RTO office taking a personal leave, take the test as per the rules, and the inspector keeps failing you multiple times citing some unknown ordinance, what do you do ? Demand a departmental inquiry there ? Enlist the help of an RTI activist ? You can maybe , if you have all the time in the world ! Most do not, hence they pay a bribe and move on. Is it the right thing to do ? NO ! But is it necessary to get on with your daily life ? YES !

One of the guys I know worked at a commercial tax dept., and he used to tell me that , sometimes, some of the meaner businessmen, give them a choice - either accept a bribe and allow them to have their way, or face a truck load of trouble, threat to life/family etc ! And they have little protection when they go on raids, certainly not a match for some of the armed hooligans they face. What should the officer do in this case ? He has no choice but to succumb to the system.

 

Sad state of affairs really

[Bird Bird Bird]

A friend of mine during the college days used to be regular in my group.

We once went to take lunch in a decent food joint, and i asked him what kind of food would he prefer (i meant to ask the cuisine)

 

His instant reply: Muft ka!

And his daddy was... guess n wait for it.. A Policeman!

Saale, mujhe sirf pancakes khila ke bhaga diya.

[Man In The Box]

 

You guys are too easy

[Spacescreamer]

mujhe sirf pancakes khila ke bhaga diya..

 

 

When did i say i purchased anything for that corrupt son of a corrupt thulla??

 

 

And only pancakes?? Muffin bhi tha (slurp) + aloo patty and coffee.. proper Brkfast tha man

 

 

 

That police guy, he freed some land in Gt Noida for a fellow from encroachers.. and in return he asked for Ritz car.

Then again performed his duty properly for some factory owner and when the owner showed his gratitude by saying Thank You.. his clear words were: "Toh tuney mera kya fayeda kiya.." he said that twice, and then the factory owner asked his gatekeeper to load a TV set in the car for the thulla.

 

Then this college guy went to comp shop, and liked a pc game, genuine disc.. simply pocketed it with the shop owner looking at him and he acknowledges the eye contact and leaves. No charge!

 

He had a 40" CRT + state of the art 2.1 channel speakers n comp when none of the business class people from my college had the same in their home.

And he openly boasted, that we take out the circuit fuse from the meter to avoid electricity charges.

 

 

I obv was disgusted and cut my contacts with him. If his father was not capable enough to get a better paying job, THIS is the way he tries to get it. And he instills the same 'values' in his kids.