The Xbox Series X|S thread

[CarbonCore]

8 hours ago, KnackChap said:

 

And don mattrick. Dude got kojima to come on the show for rising and got him to open the developer montage for Xbox one. Got square enix to make a mainline FF title multi-platform, got square to release multiple exclusives for xbox, got almost all big japanese developers making exclusive games for xbox. Even his e3 show at xbox launch had a better lineup than this. They just threw him under the bus for that bad few months of PR. Had he been in Spencer's place, he would've turned around the brand by now. 

 

Yeah he made one mistake and people wanted his head. Maybe he should've learned to talk like a politician and said stuff that everyone wanted to hear.

[CarbonCore]

8 minutes ago, adity said:

Tbh xbox one launch was a colossal f**k up. 

Xbox had literally nothing going for it. Bigger size, higher prize, lower power, fewer exclusives, always online and no used games. There was nothing anyone could do after that point to undo the damage. If not for that, I feel the difference would've been more like 25-30 percent between ps and Xbox rather that what it is now. 

 

The big one was online DRM and no used games. If they didn't have that I bet the rest could've been managed. They had way more exclusives than PS4 at launch and throughout 2014.

[Right]

9 hours ago, Big Boss said:

Someone posted this on GAF way before DF analysis. :https://imgur.com/gallery/rQk7gG5

 

This guy is a xbox shill. Just listen to his excuses, "lighting was not looking good because they showed incorrect area" lol

Lighting part is valid, but we can all see that the textures lack details and environment  lacks richness, those things Raycasting cannot fix.

Though he himself mentioned that materials on models are plasticy and look very earth-ly.

Overall raycasting would give just 10% improvement to visuals. 

[KnackChap]

And they backtracted on both online drm and used games prior to launch. Xbox actually sold better in the US at launch despite the higher price point but mattrick was made the scapegoat and let go even before the console launch. 

[PhantomShade]

19 minutes ago, KnackChap said:

And they backtracted on both online drm and used games prior to launch. Xbox actually sold better in the US at launch despite the higher price point but mattrick was made the scapegoat and let go even before the console launch. 

 

Sony was already living rent free in buyer's heads by then.

aside from those two factors, xbone was

much bigger and uglier

sold only with a shitty peripheral you will not use

sold as a bundle for $500

weak af hardware, like i still remember people bashing the xbone in 2015 for having 900p and 720p games inspite of being "next gen"

 

[Big Boss]

20 minutes ago, Right said:

Lighting part is valid, but we can all see that the textures lack details and environment  lacks richness, those things Raycasting cannot fix.

Though he himself mentioned that materials on models are plasticy and look very earth-ly.

Overall raycasting would give just 10% improvement to visuals. 

Watch this DF criticism video:

 

Watch from 4:28 onwards. Abusive language aside, the guy points out weapon reflection in water when far away lol, spaceship going through trees, muzzle flash casting no light, no bullet effects on enemy Armor, the plasma bombs being lame etc. Even compares to old Bungie Halo games. Basically 343 is just terrible developer and can't even get basic things right.

 

[roun90]

20 hours ago, -13- said:

Sorry to sound ignorant as I'm not up to date with the PC games industry. Can anyone explain how PC games companies are surviving with dirt cheap game prices, Steam/Epic store sales etc.? They're obviously not following the traditional $60 business model and are still afloat. Are they in just as much hell as we're predicting MS to be in?

 

Steam Sale - Games generally do not launch with a discount, unless the title is niche/devs are small and want to give incentive to buy on launch. Steam Sales happen gradually. So, there will be no discounts on launch or even the next sale (If date is near enough). And then once enough time passes and demand keeps dropping, devs will give more and more game % discounts (Starting with say 10/20% some 3 months down the line to 50% off 1 year down the line). So devs are not actually making a loss here. They are trying to increase the demand, which has come down due to launch hype finishing, by giving more sales. Regional Pricing is another matter (Cos try to give games cheap in countries which have low gamer hobby and lesser income to get more demand, but if people from other countries abuse it via VPN, that facility is withdrawn)

 

Epic Sale - Epic foots the bill. Epic pays the devs for the discounts on launch. And that $10 off coupon - Epic is paying $10 to the devs on your behalf so you buy from their store. Devs are not giving any discount, Epic is just footing your bill. This will continue until their competition (Namely: Steam) is killed off and then they can have their virtual monopoly, during which time they will raise prices and recoup all the costs they have borne to kill off competitors. This is called "Predatory Pricing" and the companies most famous for this are Amazon and Walmart, who generally open in other countries with this practice (even selling at loss if necessary), drive off all the local competition and then enjoy the monopoly in that area

 

Gamepass - MS pays the devs to put the games on their service, just like Netflix pays for all the 3rd party content in their service. Again, the $1 offer is not meant to be permanent. It is MS footing your bill/selling at loss until they get their desired numbers. Once enough people have been locked into their ecosystem, and don't have enough alternatives (Like say buying games at full price/discount or worst of all - 2nd hand) it will be back to normal pricing of Rs 400/600 per month or even more. Frankly, even if people have years of their offer of $1 Gamepass remaining, I can see MS cancelling it and asking people to pay up full price. I'm sure there are terms in their ToS that say "Service is Provided at their discretion and can be rescinded at any time" and "Prices are subject to Change at any time" or things to that effect, so legally they are covered.

 

AFAIK, none of the companies are doing you any favors. They just have objectives that they want to fulfill and at the end of the day - you have to decide which practice you like more. Devs will not lose, that much I think all publishers will see to it.

 

This is just my interpretation of the situation.

[PhantomShade]

1 minute ago, Big Boss said:

Watch this DF criticism video:

 

Watch from 4:28 onwards. Abusive language aside, the guy points out weapon reflection in water when far away lol, spaceship going through trees, muzzle flash casting no light, no bullet effects on enemy Armor, the plasma bombs being lame etc. Even compares to old Bungie Halo games. Basically 343 is just terrible developer and can't even get basic things right.

 

 

btw this reminds me, since next gen people are doing such beautiful particle effects, whether it's fire or lightning idk, like in infamous SS that released 5 years ago the particle effects still look good now, in this they look like garbage, they have lasers they have plasma and other scifi weaponry, yet the effects on those look like from some old a*s Halo, not next gen 12 tflops title

 

[Big Boss]

 
btw this reminds me, since next gen people are doing such beautiful particle effects, whether it's fire or lightning idk, like in infamous SS that released 5 years ago the particle effects still look good now, in this they look like garbage, they have lasers they have plasma and other scifi weaponry, yet the effects on those look like from some old a*s Halo, not next gen 12 tflops title [emoji38]
 

Apparently this is the old school look that some Halo fans will love now and will say this is perfect and fine.

[PhantomShade]

1 minute ago, Big Boss said:

3 minutes ago, PhantomShade said:

 
btw this reminds me, since next gen people are doing such beautiful particle effects, whether it's fire or lightning idk, like in infamous SS that released 5 years ago the particle effects still look good now, in this they look like garbage, they have lasers they have plasma and other scifi weaponry, yet the effects on those look like from some old a*s Halo, not next gen 12 tflops title
 

Apparently this is the old school look that some Halo fans will love now and will say this is perfect and fine.

 

 wtf.

 

Also lol @ the DF video, unless it's the hand expressions old dude i don't even watch

 

tbh the graphics on this look like they did a remake/remaster of Halo 2 or 3 for the XSX

[Pacifier]

Why didn't DF break down the resolution of the demo? They did that to even Sackboy and said it's running at 1512p 

[CarbonCore]

2 minutes ago, Pacifier said:

Why didn't DF break down the resolution of the demo? They did that to even Sackboy and said it's running at 1512p 

 

I think they just assumed that its native 4K.

[KnackChap]

More reason for them to double check as the developers themselves have said that the resolution is up to 4k and not native 4k

[roun90]

20 hours ago, -13- said:

 

?

 

That seems way too high. I had no idea.

 

Why do you think it's too high? Do you know how valuable the service provided by Steam/Sony/MS is? Applying with them does not just give you a listing - it gives you an instant access to high trust, high visibility and access millions of customers instantly. Devs don't have to go with these store services. They also have the option of selling the game via their own website and promoting it by themselves too. They would have to pay exactly 0% commission. But then - how many people will trust enough to buy from you? You will first have to prove that you are a reliable developer/game seller and not a scammer looking for credit card details. Then you will have to market the game so hard it comes out on top in Google and other search platforms (Most of the chances are - your site itself will be lost in the junk that fills Google), only then will you be able to even start marketing/talking about your game itself.

 

Steam/PS4/MS Store though - just by listing people will know you are a game dev and not trying to scam them. When the game comes up in "New and Upcoming" list - it gets automatic exposure. Not to mention, Steam/Playstation/MS etc all conduct multiple events throughout the year during which you just have to submit your game trailer and features, and the game will have instant high exposure throughout the World.

 

Steam/PS4 Store/MS Store brought this trust after years of hard work. You are their partner, taking advantage of the trust and goodwill they have earned over the years. Hence their 30% charge/commission. Epic's 12% - Epic is till establishing itself and their store is not yet as popular as Steam/PSN etc. As I said previously - they will raise their commissions as well, once their objectives are fulfilled. Epic is not doing any charity.

 

@HundredProofSam Don't think any console devs will try to kill off physical. It's not just the cheap prices (and definitely not just to the extent of 500 Rs) or 2nd hand sales, there are tons of people who collect, take a game to their friends house to play the game, people who collect Steelbooks/Collector's Editions - every single thing will be destroyed.

 

Also, retailers are not as powerless on the console front as they are on PC front. Unlike PC, consoles have 1 disadvantage. PC is an open ended platform, used for everything. There is no single seller selling "PC", they are selling either components (NVidia etc) or brands (HP, Alienware etc) and PCs are used for multiple things.

 

Consoles on the other hand are sold as a complete set by 1 manufacturer (Sony/MS etc) and used for only 1 purpose (Games). So if a console maker starts getting too uppity and majorly favoring digital games to the point physical sellers are affected - Sellers just have the choice of stopping selling the consoles altogether. Retailers will just shift businesses to electronic sellers instead and not keep console stocks while they are at it. Heck, even Amazon might count in this "Retailer Striking" list. So consoles will only be sold at the manufacturer's own stores like say Sony Center/Microsoft Center etc. Do you see how uncomfortable this will be to Console Manufacturers? This will reduce both console and game sales by quite a bit. Not to mention - the dedicated game retailers are often quite knowledgeable about both consoles and games so they can market games as well, plus handle issues like sending in consoles for repairs etc. which others like Sony Centers etc. are unable to do effectively.

 

@KnackChap Doubt Don Mattrick would be able to do anything. All the X360 feats you listed - he was able to do it because of 2 things:

 

1) MS had a far larger install base (Courtesy of Sony launching 1 year later, having Cell Processor which was hard to develop for + having a very high price initially).

 

2) That Gen Xbox Team had a blank Check from the Windows Team (For example US$ 50 million paid to Rockstar just for having 1 DLC as timed exclusive - not even full exclusive)

 

Most of what you listed was MS money-hatting devs and devs being forced to develop for X360 due to install base in the West. But the damage he did was far, far worse -

 

1) He completely destroyed the image that MS stood by it's customers and reduced MS and Xbox to a bunch of corporate suits (I'm including all the E3 comments here, including the used games fiasco, always online fiasco and everything else)

 

2) Despite spending money like it was a waterfall, he came out of the PS3/X360 gen with nothing. PS3 had slightly higher sales than X360. But worse, Sony came out of that gen with multiple high profile first party IPs that they would always own, like Uncharted, Last of Us, Killzone, Infamous etc., meanwhile MS had no new IPs other than Gears and Forza. All money went to 3rd parties, whose titles they will never own.

 

3) Japanese experiment backfired hard, because while Mattrick spent tons of money on those "Exclusives" nobody in Japan would buy them and always preferred PS3 (Nationalistic Mind-set) and there were not enough fans in the West. Overall, MS came out of the "Japan" experiment with tons of money lost and almost nothing else. It really says something when even devs like Mistwalker and Tomonobu Itagaki (Team Ninja) who have a hardcore hatred for Sony stopped developing for MS and were removed out of the gaming business altogether.

 

Overall, him leaving might have benefited MS insofar that at least costs came down. I also doubt that the Windows team will be opening their purses to the Xbox team again like they did the 360 gen, so I doubt Don mattrick would be able to replicate his "Feats"

Edited July 26, 2020 by roun90

[WhiteWolf]

3 hours ago, adity said:

Tbh xbox one launch was a colossal f**k up. 

Xbox had literally nothing going for it. Bigger size, higher prize, lower power, fewer exclusives, always online and no used games. There was nothing anyone could do after that point to undo the damage. If not for that, I feel the difference would've been more like 25-30 percent between ps and Xbox rather that what it is now. 

He forced kinect. He did all tv tv bs. He put kinect into box and made it more expensive. He said dumb thing play 360 if u want to play offline lol.

 

What new first party ip he showed us when he was in charge from 2008 to 2013? Lol people saying, he brought kojima to stage    Ya to show Vengeance which is not even mainline MGS game. 

 

Now we got MGS, Yakuza, Dragon quest, nd all FF games except FF 14 online. How many Yakuza games we had on 360? Let me think?

 

We getting 2 new AAA RPG RPG 1st party Avowed and Fresh mature take on Fable from devs who know what they doing and who are talented unlike Lionhead. List me what AAA 1st party game Don gave us from 2008 to 2013?. He gave us nothing but Kinect. 

 

There's a reason Satya kicked Don and made Phill main head. If he is doing bad job then why Satya Nadella not firing him?. Lol.

 

 

Best Head of Xbox was Peter moore before Don and Shane Kim. Only fools who dont know what they talking about or remember what Don did will say Don was better for Xbox lol.

 

Edited July 26, 2020 by WhiteWolf

[WhiteWolf]

Dont bring me Alan wake and 3rd party timed exclusives. Mass effect 1 and Bioshock dont count anymore. Peter Moore brought them over to Xbox not Don.

 

 

 

Why Satya made Phill VP of all devices and entertainment if he doing bad job. Lol.

 

Also Matt Booty head of Xbox now not Phill. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by WhiteWolf

[Big Boss]

Both Phill and Don are equal imo. They gave us great memes.

[TRMNTR]

32 minutes ago, WhiteWolf said:

Also Matt Booty head of Xbox now not Phill. 

 

Pretty sure Matt is the head of the Game Studios while Phil is the head of Xbox. Are you saying that has changed? 

[WhiteWolf]

Phill has said and some some dumb things but he is nowhere as bad as Don.. Don destroyed Xbox and then went on to destroy Zynga

Edited July 26, 2020 by WhiteWolf

[WhiteWolf]

4 minutes ago, -13- said:

 

Pretty sure Matt is the head of the Game Studios while Phil is the head of Xbox. Are you saying that has changed? 

So Phill is head of Xbox and Head of all MS entertainment and devices?..After he was promoted by Satya, i thought Booty was in charge of Xbox and studios both lol