Bird Bird Bird Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 what saint has said is partly correct, these rapist......eve-teasers are the very ppl from our society, and not some aliens what we need is a mental revolution, the problem comes from its very roots..........these ppl, some of them are not given proper education, but sometimes where they are given education, they don't perceive these moral values, its something which lacks in our system.............its the very reason why some of the law or engineering students, really well educated..........at some point they turn out to be rapist or an eve-teaser. These moral values which makes us a good and complete human being, the knowledge about these things is really deficit in our country. Every individual in the environment is the sum total of the upbringing by his/her parents, teachers, & well-wishers, and also taking into account his/her muse in life. The idea is to make ppl realise the importance of these little things in our lives which makes us a good human being, & not to instill these values by coercion. the government can't change the attitude of the ppl, they can only enforce them to do as per the guidelines.............eventually it all comes down to us, Morality is the sum of all interactions a person has with his/her surroundings, right from parents to friends to TV shows to movies to the Internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteWolf Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Delhi rape victim admitted to Singapore's top hospital for specialised treatment The 23-year-old Delhi gang-rape victim was admitted on Thursday morning to the Mount Elizabeth Hospital's intensive care unit in Singapore in an extremely critical condition, a hospital spokesperson said. "The patient arrived at Mount Elizabeth Hospital's Intensive Care Unit this morning in an extremely critical condition," the spokesperson said - "She is being examined and the hospital is working with the Indian High Commission. We request that the privacy of the patient and family be respected," the spokesperson said. However, Union minister of health and family welfare Ghulam Nabi Azad on Thursday morning sais that the victim had been admitted to a Singapore hospital and was stable. "The girl reached Singapore at 5.30 in the morning. According to the report I received an hour ago, she has been admitted to the hospital and is stable," Azad told reporters in New Delhi. Earlier, the Indian High Commission in Singapore said that the plane carrying the girl landed at the Changi International Airport at 7.30 am (5 am IST). The decision to shift the girl was taken at the highest level of the Indian government. On December 16, the girl was gang-raped and brutally assaulted in a moving bus and was undergoing treatment at a hospital in Delhi. The girl, who continues to remain in a critical condition, remained on ventilator support during most part of her treatment in Delhi. The victim fighting for her life in a Delhi hospital was whisked away to Singapore on Wednesday night in a move to better her chances and limit any outburst of fury in a volatile Capital. The girl, who was brutally assaulted by six men in a moving bus ten days ago and dumped on the roadside to die, has been battling acute infection and a clot in the heart. Her stomach has been cut open twice and her small intestines have been removed. She was taken from Safdarjung Hospital to Indira Gandhi International Airport’s Terminal 1D airport at 10.30 pm and boarded a chartered 12-seater aircraft an hour later from Delhi airport. With her were her parents, two relatives, two nursing staff and two doctors. Prior to the move, three police vans and two cars full of policemen kept watch outside the hospital. http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-news/NewDelhi/Delhi-rape-victim-admitted-to-Singapore-s-top-hospital-for-specialised-treatment/Article1-981306.aspx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sa1nT_SoLd1eR Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Errr, right. So 20-30,000 people don't represent the nation but a bunch of 100 politicians do ? A bunch of politicians who have joined politics only for the sake of minting money ? A bunch of politicians who are least bothered about what happens on the roads while they are busy paying a crore for their son's education in US ? A bunch of politicians whose only way to make a point is to shout and throw chairs and mics in the LS and the RS ? A bunch of politicians who are curtail our rights by arresting it's own citizens if something offensive against them is posted on social media sites ? I would rather stand with those 30k fools (many of whom I agree cannot be farther from the truth) rather than these bunch of "elected" politicians. Exactly my point, the moment one starts to question, disrespect the mandate given via votes cast by millions, you are stepping on their rights, just like one does not like their rights being stepped on, similarly the other person also does not like his rights being trampelled on the streets of Delhi. When one lacks that sensitivity, and gets carried away by emotion, it can all turn very ugly very soon, and that is why democratci institutions have to be respected, even if one does not like the person occupying that position for one reason or the other ... If you have proof then move court, work hard and built up an agitation, join politics. But just beacuse all that is hard to do, and violent protests seems to be the easy way out, does not make it legitimate as such. yes the system is bad but then what is perfect in this world. Is your family perfect ? is my family perfect ? .... NO, nothing is perfect in this world, but you cannot break the whole family up just beacuse you don't find it to your liking. Working hard to close the loopholes, mending own ways and patching up misunderstandings, even if it means listening to a few words not to your liking is the least that can be asked from a family member in such a situation, but even if one member gets violent in such a situation, then one is opening a pandora's box and even people who wanted to stay together in such a family will face large scale consequneces due to the mindlessness of one member. This is how riots occur. Today it was constable Tomar's family who had to pay the price for the protest of some unruly elements, who donot believe in this democracy, tomorrow it can be me, you or anyone else, who knows !! Are you ready to pay that price ? I sure am not !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
achilles Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Here is a glimpse of the impractical ..... Police to people ratio in India 1 : 1000 National average, state wise average is even worse Indian economy is roughly 2 Trillion, USA economy is 14 Trillion, 7 times that of India Indian Population is around 1.3 Billion, USA's Population around 33 Crores and i can go on and on .... JUST see at the disparity, this is exactly what I am saying about the immaturity of the so called educated literate youths of this country, there is literally no comparison and therefore to expect Indian government to deliver like USA is just plain ridiculous First of all, I think all would undisputedly agree that whatever the stats, our nation can be a lot better in terms of everything if our politicians would do their rightful duty. Second of all, it is not wrong to aspire to be like the best. It is always better to compare to someone better and try to think what all can be done to reach that level rather than look at stats and compare to someone lesser and feel good or okay about yourself. Anyway, we (or the 20k odd in discussion here) are not even saying we want a situation like the states or any developed nation. Do you even know how much the people can rattle the govt. there, and how much the govt. is answerable even though they provide for their citizens much better living conditions than what we have here? It is not immature to ask for safety. It is not immature to imagine a day when women of all ages will not have to think twice before going out alone anywhere and at any time in India. Infact, I think it is highly mature. Now a2nd day most of those gathered at India gate were students, and I asked people who were going to look for jobs in the near future, and noone could even say it downright 100% that they are ready to sacrifice their pleasures for serving the country in a better way. This is not the noble cause I am talking about, this is the national reality, 2000 schools were shut down yesterday in Punjab because less than 20 children were enrolling in such schools, and no teacher was ready to come an teach in schools located at villages.... over 80,000 teaching jobs are lying vacant in UP, and there are literally no takers for these, and those who do want to take these jobs, don't even know the abcd of teaching in the first place. Isn't it the duty of the so called Elites of Delhi and other major cities to impart education to people who don't have the means to do so., but all they can do is light candles in streets.Then how do you expect this country to change, and that is why i call these people a bunch of retarded hypocrites, because all they can do is light candles on streets instead of lighting up the lives of their fellow citizens !!! I think I and Bird Bird Bird have already answered this adequately. No, it is not their duty. It is the government's duty which should be realised by our taxes a part of which are collected specifically for this purpose. Even then, the government does not make it easy for people who would want to do it, like Bird has already said. And it is still not relevant to the topic at hand. WHat all these violent protests have led to is ruining of a family, assurances by government, who know what the ground reality is, and they know that is all they can do with the resources at hand, with over 4 crore cases pending in Indian courts what else can the government of the day do, judges are alredy burdened to extremes in India all this has only led to opportunistic politicians earning their brownie points, and the Bastard Media houses after killing a policeman is back to their jingle bell as usual !!! That's all this protest has done !!! Nope what it means is that instead of wasting time and energy into useless candle marches, and violent protests people should change their own attitude and invest this time and energy into lighting up the lives of the undeserved of this country, even if you can't go to far off places, then atleast try to change your ownself and put your own house in order, instead of ruining someone else's just for the heck of protesting !!!! That is all I am trying to say here !!! There is a clear line between practical and Impractical, no-one is ready to change themselves and are ready to hop on the first chance to flagg the government and everything else. Anyone with a sane mind, would know the practical aspect of what is possible and not possible. With over 4 crore cases pending in courts, people expecting to fast track every rape case, is just ridiculous and impractical !!! the anti- corruption movement was a political movement from the get-go, everyone who was trying to get this fact out in the public got flagged, including on this forum (check the Anna Hazaare thread) in this section only. I only feel angry and sad for the family that lost their sole earning hand just because of the collective stupidity of the hypocrite educated youths of this country, politiicans, as well as the so called 'Free' and 'unbiased' media houses, and all this has only led to ruining of a family, and removing a father's protection from the heads of 3 studying youths, who now have to live their whole life as a consequence of this same hypocricy. I know what the odds are for me getting any headway into getting this point across, as I have had first hand experience of that in many cases both on and off forums including the so called Anti- corruption movement !!! i don't know whether or not the girl will live to see another day, but a person died today and those who contributed towards that end, are sitting in their cosy beds, playing farmville on facebook, or whatsuppping on their android phones, while the family has their whole life to live with what they lost in that riot, and the sad thing is people still feel that the sole responsibility is of the government, and the only responsibility they have is to light candles on streets and to vote every 5 years, the rest is upto the government to do... I say Bloody Hippie BS !!!! You know, this is the classic attitude of a has been. We have all heard it time and again and it goes like this. "I (in this case you) have done all of this and I know how it is done. What you (in this case the 20k odd retarded hypocrites and whoever does not hold the same opinion as you here) are doing is wrong. You'll never achieve what you want to by doing it this way. It's because XYZ (in this case the politicians and the media) are haramkhors/beyond you. Do what I tell you otherwise you are a idiot coz you don't know what I know." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
achilles Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Exactly my point, the moment one starts to question, disrespect the mandate given via votes cast by millions, you are stepping on their rights, just like one does not like their rights being stepped on, similarly the other person also does not like his rights being trampelled on the streets of Delhi. When one lacks that sensitivity, and gets carried away by emotion, it can all turn very ugly very soon, and that is why democratci institutions have to be respected, even if one does not like the person occupying that position for one reason or the other ... Do you know how a contract works? In effect, the government of India is under a 5 year contract with every one of its citizens to (pertaining to this discussion): 1. Allow for certain undisputed conditions (Fundamental rights) 2. Provide for what all was promised before getting the contract It is an individual contract, with each separate citizen. So, if 20,000 or even 2000 or even 2 people find that that contract was not upheld to their end, they have every right to demand and question because one end of the contract was not upheld. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sa1nT_SoLd1eR Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Once again you are mixing up contract theory, marxist theory and Democratic theory !!!! There is huge difference between a contract and a mandate, with all due respect, please refer to political Science books of BA Part-1, as this forms as the basic building blocks of knowledge for understanding the concept of state and sovereignity !!! I reiterate no disrespect was meant by my above comment, even it may seem so to your kind self, a democratic government is given a mandate which is very different than a contract. As far their right goes, every citizen has that right, but they have no right to step on the rights of others !!!! Just like rape is an offence, similarly 20 - 30,000 people gathering up and involving in violent protests are raping the democracy of it's inherent virtue !!! No voice can be deemed to be greater than others, every voice has a right to be heard, but that person must also understand that one cannot infringe on the right of others by doing so, and thus comes the reason for doing everything peacefully, and dissociating oneself from such a protest if it is turning violent. Anyone failing to do that is infringing on the democratic right of others, and is thus sailing in the same boat as any other rapist, who rapes a girl of her innocence and honour, similarly anyone endorsing violent protests in a democratic country is also raping democracy of it's own inherent virtue !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 If you have proof then move court, work hard and built up an agitation, join politics. But just beacuse all that is hard to do, and violent protests seems to be the easy way out, does not make it legitimate as such. yes the system is bad but then what is perfect in this world. Lol. And joining politics is as easy as going to a halwai wala's shop ? Dude, you're in Noida, part of UP. You, of all people, should know how politicians work. IAS/IPS officers are treated like dogs, Mayawati likes a house and buys it, giving the original owners a pittance of the price and robbing them of their beloved home, crooks roam freely because they're inclined to one party or the other, CBI is treated like a personal bodyguard etc etc. The list is endless. If I'm standing at one end with all honesty and integrity and there's a hardcore money laundering politician at the other end, with crores of rupees to throw around, where will the majority go ? If I go to a poor village and promise 10000 people that I'll try and give them 24 hours of electricity and water whereas the other politician organizes a rally where every one of those 10k are promised 1000 rupees each, where will those people go ? It's not about not joining politics. I'm pretty sure we can produce many honest and intellectual leaders given the chance, but the system is so corrupt that it's virtually impossible for a person with values to survive the ordeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sa1nT_SoLd1eR Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Not everything has to be done at a large scale, one can start from his ownself, his own house, his own locality, his own city, and just putting that point across is actually making me an arrogant turd, as was pointed out by someone, but I can live with that, provided it actually makes anyone reading think twice before joining such violent protests in future. Anyways , I feel I have said what i wanted to, and it's time to move on, this is The News thread and i donot want to derail it anymore with this debate, cos it really has no end. I hope nothing like what happened with that girl, or constable Tomar's family happens to anyone here atleast, and people do start listening to their inner voice instead of listening to media houses or political leaders of today !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
achilles Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Okay. Let's make a few things absolutely clear. As far their right goes, every citizen has that right, but they have no right to step on the rights of others !!!! Just like rape is an offence, similarly 20 - 30,000 people gathering up and involving in violent protests are raping the democracy of it's inherent virtue !!! No voice can be deemed to be greater than others, every voice has a right to be heard, but that person must also understand that one cannot infringe on the right of others by doing so, and thus comes the reason for doing everything peacefully, and dissociating oneself from such a protest if it is turning violent. The youth, the students and ordinary citizens did everything peacefully. Certain people, who were not part of the original movement decided to join, make it violent and give it another spin for their interests. At this point, the police retaliated on everyone, including the peaceful guys who did not want to or even need to, indulge in violence. I would say that at this point, the police could have used discretion and not try to be violent on the women and girls and the peaceful youth present but that's besides the point. The decent guys, the youth out there tried to even shield these women from the water cannons and the lathi charge. So, they did not try to be unlawful or unreasonable or above 'equals'. They tried to get their point across in the best way we know right now. Maybe there's a better way to make their voices heard but we as a nation haven't figured it out yet. Anyone failing to do that is infringing on the democratic right of others, and is thus sailing in the same boat as any other rapist, who rapes a girl of her innocence and honour, similarly anyone endorsing violent protests in a democratic country is also raping democracy of it's own inherent virtue !!! Dude. Just. I don't know. Dude. Edit: Also, mandate is really a pre cursor to a contract and that's why I said in effect. Anyway, again, besides the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Not everything has to be done at a large scale, one can start from his ownself, his own house, his own locality, his own city, and just putting that point across is actually making me an arrogant turd, as was pointed out by someone, but I can live with that, provided it actually makes anyone reading think twice before joining such violent protests in future. I agree mate, things can be started on a smaller scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
achilles Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 If you have proof then move court, work hard and built up an agitation, join politics. But just beacuse all that is hard to do, and violent protests seems to be the easy way out Protests are easy? Er, no. They are not. Questioning the established order is always tough. Wether through court or through peaceful protests. Anyway, With 10,000 cases for 1 judge, and with judges working for over 14 hours on an average, you tell me, is it a legitimate demand to fast track every case in this country !!!! Your words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALPHA17 Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 I would say that at this point, the police could have used discretion and not try to be violent on the women and girls and the peaceful youth present but that's besides the point. The decent guys, the youth out there tried to even shield these women from the water cannons and the lathi charge. “Just as water will conform to the shape of the vessel that contains it, so will a man follow the good and evil of his companions." Imagawa Sadayo In a real-life scenario it is not such an easy task to discern between the crowd of neutrals / Good and a Mob of destruction / Bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Right Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Prez's son who is an MP too: "Women who are participating in candle-light vigils and those who are protesting have no connection with ground reality. These pretty ladies coming out to protest are 'highly dented and painted'," he said to the ABP television channel in Bengal. (Watch) "I have my doubts...how many of these women are students...women in these age groups are generally no longer students." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abhi90 Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 I'll have to give one point to the politicians here just for the fact that they surprise me everytime when I'm expecting that I can't be surprised anymore as I've seen everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bird Bird Bird Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 True that. Though nothing beats eating chowmein in Harayana. :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abhi90 Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Ever tried local chowmein in madurai? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rohan Seth Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Saint has a very good point. We have very less judges and they carry a huge bundle of cases everyday. How can we expect a reasonable and quick judgement out of them? @Udham yea i read that His sister is now apologizing to the public for what he said. Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Right Posted December 29, 2012 Report Share Posted December 29, 2012 Don't want to turn the TV on. This is sad as sh*t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hope Posted December 29, 2012 Report Share Posted December 29, 2012 Why are those bastards still not punished What are they waiting for MC BC Government Idiots have police all around Delhi now Really man have no words for this incident. RIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phreak Posted December 29, 2012 Report Share Posted December 29, 2012 India is dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.