The News Thread

[dylanjosh]

Godwin's law!

[playstation]

has been explained in detailed manner in the last few pages, if you care to read ( Difference between state sponsored & state ignored riots )

Those are just terms for the books... In reality i am sure you also know that Congress are as much responsible for Sikh riots as Bjp is for Gujrat riots.

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

BJP-RSS ideology & politics rests on Anti Muslim sentiment and calling for a 'Hindutva state', whereas the same cannot be said for congress in case of 1984 Anti-sikh riots, as has been explained earlier !!!

[Right]

 

See the resemblence, if you can't then God Bless you & this country !!!

Nope, I don't see it.

 

And there is no point arguing on this, discussions keep going towards things which are not to be discussed here.

The forum isn't meant for all that.

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

Lol, it wasn't me who started it, I just stated my personal opinion on incidents of rapes and why this cannot be looked into as a country specific problem, it's not intended to cause discomfort, nor am I forcing anyone to subscribe to my views !!

 

Anyways peace !!

[Right]

No, your stance about ignoring that the current situation is due to problem with growing lack of "law and order" and insensitivity in the country and passing it as a global phenomenon.

 

"What the hell is wrong with our country?"

"Duh, it happens in US of A too"

 

That's how I read it.

Feel free to repeat your argument that India doesn't have enough police personnels or judges in proportion of the population.

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

About lower police & judge ratios, it is a fact which cannot be denied including lapses in law & order !!

 

Coming to the point about lack of "law & order", then in comparison to what ? is it in comparison to other countriues, if yes, then on one hand you are "accusing" me of comparing India with other countries & on the other you are trying to prove your point by doing the same.

 

If it is in comparison to our own policing system then i am in agreement that standards have been falling over the years !!

 

That Duh !! of yours is your own interpretation, as I did give a rider alongwith the statement, so that it isn't misinterpreted by people reading it in isolation, but you have very casually omitted the same to prove your point !!!

[Right]

That's a fact which cannot be denied including lapses in law & order,

That's the only concern everyone here has, really. "Law and order" cannot be measured statistically, neither one should intend to.

 

Good edit on "Hypocricy" that.

 

 

 

 

That Duh !! of yours is your own interpretation, as I did give a rider alongwith the statement, so that it isn't misinterpreted by people reading it in isolation, but you have very casually omitted the same to prove your point !!!

 

 

It isn't just India, it's everywhere, even USA, Oprah is also a rape survivor who was assaulted by one of her own family member at a very tender age of 9 years, so I don't buy the argument of these acts being country specific, every country has it's share of 'rotten souls' roaming among the 'not so rotten souls' !!

Please correct me if I missed to read between the lines.

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

That's the only concern everyone here has, really. "Law and order" cannot be measured statistically, neither one should intend to.

 

Good edit on "Hypocricy" that.

 

I share that concern as well, but by specifically targetting India as a country of rapists, without having a holistic view as to why this trend is increasing is 'naive' to say the least, the problem is universal was my only plea, not to justify the rapes, as is being made out to be !!

 

Statistics are just a helping hand to gauge a society's makeup, history & it's well being !! If there are no statistics and only whims of each and every individual are to be the basis on which a country gets evaluated, then I am afraid it is not possible. Statistics is a middle ground between whims and fantasies, and your ignorance to this fact is enough to convince me not to take this argument further with your kind self, since you don't even know what importance statistics has for a society !!

 

The edit on hypocrisy was becuase i could have misinterpreted your statement about lack of law & order so I edited and added the next 2 lines, and once again you succeed to see the edit on hypocrisy, but you fail to see the next 2 lines that were added to make up for your lack of specificity !!

[DishuBOSS]

has been explained in detailed manner in the last few pages, if you care to read ( Difference between state sponsored & state ignored riots )

 

I dont have time to read all the pages in the back (have a tight deadline to meet as of now).. so are you saying that the riots of 84 were state 'ignored' riots ???

 

Are you implying that the Congress govt didnt play any role other than just ignoring whatever happened back then ??

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

^ In case of 1984, the riots were an outburst of latent anger that had been fuelled by both parites, the lower rung congress leaders were involved in the riots, the police played an active role on the behest of these leaders, there is no denying that some of the senior congress party leaders could have also played a part, the gandhi family & most of those close to Gandhis were busy with the mourning & funeral of Mrs. Gandhi, the post of PM was vacant, Rajiv Gandhi was sworn in as interim PM and and on the third day since the demise of Mrs. Gandhi, Rajiv gandhi took control of the situation and ordered the police to act and stop the rioting. Paramilitary forces were called out and rioting was stopped.

 

In case of gujarat, the planning of these riots was there for years, the hate speeches by VHP leaders, and distribution of 'Trishuls' and hate slogans were there for quite a few months, (political reasons) smalll communal incidents led to the big incident of Godhra train, and then all hell broke loose, thousands were cornered and butchered and Mr. Modi being in the state itself did not intervene even after 4 days, MR. Vajpayee took cognisance & sent paramilitary forces but they were also shunned from interfering in the genocide by the state police, even though Mr. vajpayee tried his best to contain the situation but with RSS pulling the strings and BJP being subservient to RSS, he could not do much, his statement of "Mr Modi not complying with the Raj Dharam" on a public platform was indicative of the pain he felt on his helplessness to contain this genocide in his tenure, print & electronic media was banned for months even after the riots had ended !!

 

 

Now those who were still small at that time (2002) have reached the voting age today and the media is working in tandom with BJP in trying to mainpulate this section of the society to bring them in power at the centre, their communal face is being guarded and suppressed and a new face focussed on development & governance is being projected so that they don't loose this section of voters who number in crores BTW, another face of their strategy is to show congress in a bad light so as to contrast the picture more, the animated debates and the heights of Double standards being professed by the media (all formats) are a testimony to this fact. Congress has been on a politically weak wicket with Mrs. Sonia Gandhi being out of picture for a long time since her sickness came to the fore, BJP-RSS used this time to strike with the Anna Hazaare movement, but it swung out of their control and infact resulted in loss of their own urban vote bank. Mr. Arvind Kejriwal thought of hitting a 'sixer' by destroying the constitution itself, and all that politics that was played in the Anna Hazaare movement of gheraoing the MP's, MLA's and the Parliament was in tune with his plan, he miscalculated and got clean bowled.

 

An estimate has put the voting population between the age of 18 - 23 at around 30 crores, So this is what BJP & Media is trying to manipulate as it serves both their purpose as has been explained in detail before, the reason is that people in this age group are naive and can be easily manipulated as they haven't had the life experiences that others have had, and don't understand the politics of power in it's true sense, they get easily carried away by what they see on TV or what they read on facebook & forums like these !!!

 

 

All this has been explained in detail and I do not wish to derail the thread again, as it wasn't liked by other members in the past !!!

[DishuBOSS]

I dont know why people get all boiled up with anger while discussing things on a forum.

We all have our own opinions and there is nothing wrong in a healthy debate.

 

Now back to the riot thing;

Here are my two cents: I believe both BJP and Congress have their hands stained with blood of innocents. But again, these are the only two parties that are going to rule us for the next (assuming) 50 years.

 

Unless a third major group emerges that promises to make things right, we are stuck to chose between these two parties.

You may be a leftist, or a pro-dalit or anybody else.. but even your support will feed any of these two parties after the elections are over.

 

Faaruq Shaikh's character in the movie Shanghai (2012) says to Abhay Deol's chatacter, "Ye aurat PM ban sakti thi.. China se aage nikal sakte the hum log (This woman could have been the next PM.. plunging us ahead of China)."

 

So the question is this; you know a leader can take your country ahead. It can deliver the promises of development that you have been fed by the others. But there are some dark sides to this person (regardless of being proven or unproven) and now its upto you to decide whether you want to move forward or just label him as a 'monster' and hand the reign to the other monsters with even bigger skeletons in the cabinet.

 

I am rooting for Modi in the next elections.

[Solitaire]

People. Spell check and grammar.. Please

 

I'm dying here.

[Right]

I share that concern as well, but by specifically targetting India as a country of rapists, without having a holistic view as to why this trend is increasing is 'naive' to say the least, the problem is universal was my only plea, not to justify the rapes, as is being made out to be !!\

Yeah, so the problem is not limited to India and situation here has been deteriorated due to lack of "Law and Order".

But definitely this wasn't conveyed in your post.

 

What disgust me is that uncle was roaming scot-free until the FIR was filed until last week, what stopped the father until so - social stigma or the disbelief in the legal system - is anybody's guess.

And I definitely don't want to see a statistics of Population VS Police VS Crime drawn for a decade and compared across the states and countries, in present scenario nothing of that will make anyone feel lesser unsafe.

[DishuBOSS]

People. Spell check and grammar.. Please

 

I'm dying here.

 

Bhai I can write in Hindi but some members might not be able to understand

[Solitaire]

Haha no no it's okay. I'm just a Grammar Nazi. I can read Hindi too but it's better to write in something everyone understands. The Grammar Nazi in me blew a fuse when I saw "hypocrisy" go for a toss a bunch of times. I think Chrome (don't know if IE does it) shows your spelling errors underlined in red, so it's not hard to do it.

 

 

See, the problem is I don't find the same level of safety (perceived or otherwise) walking around a place like Delhi with a female friend as I would have maybe 4-5 years ago. It could very well be that the media hype around this is a bit much. In the US, I know certain places are bad and crime-riddled (Detroit for instance - heck Robocop predicted a decade ago what would happen to that place ) and I don't think any country's capital especially should be at a state where you're sometimes referring to it as the rape capital. Just think, we blame the US but you don't expect to go out with your girlfriend to a club in the US and then have a bunch of men beat you up and grope your friend on the way back because she dressed a particular way right? We publicly parade our traditions when it comes to dress-sense and what not but the hundreds of years of tradition we so proudly point to don't seem to influence our behavior in certain other aspects.

 

Leave alone Delhi, in general with so many incidents of not just rape, but senseless acts of violence (I remember someone shot some lady and her daughter a few months ago because they objected to him taking a piss on their outside wall or something, then some shooting because someone got into a fight outside a restaurant for making them spill their lunch on the road etc.) it's a situation where, even though the general public aren't all rapists and murderers, it just is uncomfortable for me, as an Indian, to accept that such a spike in crime is happening and there's a certain level of apathy about it (despite all these candlelight vigils and TV protests). Occasionally someone tries to stop such a crime and then they themselves are targeted and killed. I'd understand if these were some mob-orchestrated hits that were happening and the police couldn't stop it but when some joker can come back and *beep* you up for standing up to them then it's going downhill a bit too fast.

[dylanjosh]

Haha no no it's okay. I'm just a Grammar Nazi. I can read hindi too but it's better to write in something everyone understands. The Grammar Nazi in me blew a fuse when I saw "hypocrisy" go for a toss a bunch of times. I think Chrome (don't know if IE does it) shows your spelling errors underlined in red, so it's not hard to do it.

 

I like to imagine they force you to use IE at Microsoft.

[DishuBOSS]

Haha no no it's okay. I'm just a Grammar Nazi. I can read hindi too but it's better to write in something everyone understands. The Grammar Nazi in me blew a fuse when I saw "hypocrisy" go for a toss a bunch of times. I think Chrome (don't know if IE does it) shows your spelling errors underlined in red, so it's not hard to do it.

 

 

^ NO SOUP FOR YOU !!!!

[Right]

Haha no no it's okay. I'm just a Grammar Nazi. I can read hindi too but it's better to write in something everyone understands. The Grammar Nazi in me blew a fuse when I saw "hypocrisy" go for a toss a bunch of times. I think Chrome (don't know if IE does it) shows your spelling errors underlined in red, so it's not hard to do it.

Spell check has stopped working on new forum for some reason, for me.

 

[Sa1nT_SoLd1eR]

Yeah, so the problem is not limited to India and situation here has been deteriorated due to lack of "Law and Order".

But definitely this wasn't conveyed in your post.

 

What disgust me is that uncle was roaming scot-free until the FIR was filed until last week, what stopped the father until so - social stigma or the disbelief in the legal system - is anybody's guess.

And I definitely don't want to see a statistics of Population VS Police VS Crime drawn for a decade and compared across the states and countries, in present scenario nothing of that will make anyone feel lesser unsafe.

 

Well i conveyed it in very clear terms by stating that this should not be made out to be country specific.

 

Why do you think everyone is so attached to the concept of growth, without economic growth improvement in living standards is not possible & that includes every aspect of social life, including law & order !!

 

 

 

PS:- Sorry for the BAD grammar, I am not too good with english !!