The Home Theatre Set-Up

[achilles]

Update 2: 

 

This past weekend was amazing. Not only was it a lot of fun, but it taught me so many things about myself. So I visited 4 demo centres this time, with one being a repeat.

 

But first, a word about the family-friend-introduced guy I'd mentioned earlier. They have said that they can't offer a demo, and they have also said that they can't offer me any other system in this price range. They have also said that they will match my sound requirements, guaranteed.  

I don't think it will work out. One, I don't like this set up, and I don't wish to take their word for it. I'm finicky, and if I don't like it, it would be really awkward for me to reject an expensive system. Two, their prices weren't the best. Three, it would be unethical of me to demo and like a system somewhere else, and ask them to get and set it up for me. So this probably won't work out. On to the demos :rubs hands in glee: 

 

Demo 1: Sound Redefined

Music guy. Young, knowledgeable, and friendly. The set up was nice, in my price range, but the vocals were off. I primarily went there because I read about SVS Subs, and wanted to try them out. The India distributor told me about them, and so I fixed up a time. While they didn't have the sub I wanted to try, I got some idea from a lower model they had in dual in the HT room. 

What I didn't like was that he was kind of weird about me using my own media. I could've easily connected my phone for music, etc. He was always like, tell me which song, and I'll play it from my collection. No. the source has to be the same, if I need an idea of the differences in set up. I didn't push too much, and I will explain why in a bit. 

The HT set up was again nice, but the vocals were off. We played Skyfall and a bunch of trailers, but the vocals just didn't hold up. I'm most finicky about vocals, as IMO they are the hardest to get 'just right'. When I told him that the vocals were off there, he was shocked (SHOCKED), and denied. I was like, okay, cool, and again, didn't push too much. 

I didn't push too much on either occasion because a, it was getting late, and it seemed like he was in a hurry to get somewhere, which was fair, and b, I've experienced that "music guys" are excellent at music, but aren't great at reproducing cinema like sound. I may be off, or they may be off, but I've visited three so far, and all three of them haven't shown me a cinema set up that works. 

 

Demo 2: EHOMZ (repeat)

This was what taught me the most about myself. I was extremely happy with the level 1 system that I had demo'd the last time, and this was also the first ever system I'd demo'd a few weeks back. When I heard it this time, I hated it. The speakers sounded crappy, like cheap, small knock-offs fixed with a high quality sub. I was dumbfounded. I played the same things which had impressed me the first time, and this time, I didn't even want to finish the songs or the scenes. I told him in no uncertain terms that I hated this now. He smiled. 

We then went into the Level 2 system, which he'd said cost 35L the last time, and this time, OMG. It was like I was hearing a completely new system. The last time I could't really see what the big deal was, or what the big difference was. This time it was like nigh and day between Level 1 and 2 systems. I started grinning, and we played everything. Movies, YouTube, music. I spent a good 3 hours in just this set up and the guy then told me that he was surprised when I hadn't noticed a big difference between the systems the first time. He had, in the proposal, sent me a system closer to level 2, than level 1, and that we'd be able to get about 80% of the sound experience from there. This made me suspicious. He didn't mention any of this earlier, and the set that he'd sent me, those speakers weren't on demo. Hmm. At this point, again, my radar was clanging. "I don't want to take your word for it. I want to demo the exact system. I have demo'd this, and I like it. Will you be able to give me this system?"

Also, he declined to change any prices from last time. He knows I'm shopping around, so those must really be the prices below which he won't go. 

Anyway, as much fun as I was having, I had to move on to demo 3 for the weekend. 

 

Demo 3: Audio Nirvana

Again, 3 levels. I liked only level 3, and that was JBL Synthesis Luxury Audio. I have not heard better vocals even in PVRs. The effects could've been better, which he acknowledged, and attributed to lack of some punch and detail to the design of the room, which he'd created a few years prior, and knows how to improve it now. Anyway, these were clearly way out of my budget, but he told me that he is planning to upgrade his showcase demo room soon, and that he would be willing to let go of these 3 year old speakers at a very decent discount, with bill and leftover warranty of 2 years. He made it sound like he could fit them in my budget, or maybe slightly over, and he sent me a proposal today. Guess how much he quoted me? 42L. Son of a bitch. He knew my budget. I told him clearly what I was comfortable with. Then WHATTHEFUK??!! See ya Mr. Nirvana. Not. 

 

Demo 4: Sight & Sound

Another place I was excited to demo because they keep Bowers & Wilkins kit, and SVS. I should've come here sooner. While research-reading, I'd read about the B&W 683S2 speakers, of how good they are, especially for vocals, and they would fit in my budget too. But I can't be that lucky, can I? The 683S2's were sold out. Even their demo piece was bought over and gone. "They're very popular sir". He instead put the new 7 series on, with a switch of 684S2s. And f**k me sideways. I loved it! Even though the 7's were treble heavy, too bright, the vocals were excellent. The B&W sub that was playing wasn't bad either, but I asked if he could put on something bigger. He did. The SVS PB 2000, the one I wanted to try in the first place, for which I'd called the India distributor. Jesus christ that thing is massive. It is a shelf, and a seat on its own. Anyway, as good as the sub looked, it didn't sound as good, but that was without any calibration, and he'd just placed it there, and connected it. 

I also liked the projector a lot, the Sony 45ES, better than any projector I'd demo'd uptill now. The only problem was it was kind of over saturated, made to (understandably) mimic an LED TV, but I guess that should be fixable by calibration. 

I again started enjoying myself, grinning and having fun. We played Skyfall again for comparison, the Infinity War trailer, The Dark Knight, Deadpool, Kong etc, and a bunch of songs. I was having so much fun, close to 4 hours just went by. The guy was nice about it too, and said that I should take all the time I need. 

 

I left asking three things of him: 

1. Get this set-up calibrated ASAP and call me

2. Get the 683s ASAP, and send me a proposal set up on e-mail

3. Arrange so I can hook my PS up to the projector and try a few games to see how it performs

 

I'll be going there again soon, and this is my current fav set up so far. I might even fix up a time so I can play God Of War there, atleast some of it  

 

[achilles]

Another weekend, another demo. Another musically inclined people. They talk a big game always, but the speakers fail to deliver, every single time, for movies. They just don't work in a home theatre set up. Either the vocals are too reverb-y, or trounced, or boomy, and it destroys my immersion. I'm sticking to home cinema specialists from now on. 

 

Going to do an extended demo of James Loudspeaker and B&W next week, the two I've liked so far. James will be slightly out of my budget, and will require an extra amp, but maybe we can work something where the front three are James, and we can compromise on the surrounds. 90% of the sound comes from front channels, and maybe we can upgrade surrounds later, if I feel the need.

 

Also, I think I'll have to start looking in Bombay soon. Delhi guys just aren't cutting it. I thought the proximity will help with my place but I can't find something I love, and I want something I love. It is weird to me that speakers that cost a couple of lakhs just aren't delivering good sound. Makes me feel that this whole segment works on marketing and is totally hokey. In comparison, I have a Sony free standing Bluetooth thing for 35k in my room right now, and it works pretty damn good.  

[achilles]

Question: Anyone here have any experience with tactile transducers? @AtheK or anyone else? Seems like they can be a lot of fun specially for gaming! 

[Pacifier]

^Thank you for my Google search word of the day.

[AtheK]

1 hour ago, achilles said:

Question: Anyone here have any experience with tactile transducers? @AtheK or anyone else? Seems like they can be a lot of fun specially for gaming! 

no man...

[hope]

Great Job Ducky  Quite insightful your posts are. One day One Day 

[achilles]

3 hours ago, Pacifier said:

^Thank you for my Google search word of the day.

 

I stumbled across them while trying to know more about Earthquake Sound, and from what I've read, anyone who's tried them, mostly loves them. The premise sounds lovely too, get all the shakin', none of the bakin'.  

 

12 minutes ago, hope said:

Great Job Ducky  Quite insightful your posts are. One day One Day 

 

Thanks hope   

[achilles]

I have just had an epiphany. I have been trying to compromise on some fronts to get this HT set-up to fit in my room, and go with the aesthetics and flow, while I have an unused, wasteful garage in front of my drive way just sitting there, occupying space. Why don't I just use that (current) waste fo space, and do a proper, and I do mean a fkn propah home theatre set up, with starscape ceiling, acoustic treatments, the works. 

Why I was hesitant earlier? I think the garage is kind of small. It's 16x9.5x7.5. The ceiling is kind fo low, which limits my screen size to a max of 8 feet wide. Still, it's not too bad. And the other reason was that I do like music in my room, and I could've used the HT set-up to double up as a music system too. While that would have had its own drawbacks, the sheer convenience of having it in my room was making me go for it full hog. 

However. 

This is not an apartment. This is my house. And having a dedicated HT room, even smaller, can give me a much better experience, for approximately the same cost, except for some additional furniture required, but that leaves my room free from any incumbencies or heavy duty requirements of the HT. It can just be my room, and I can add a decent 2.1 set up there for my music and get together needs, while the garage HT can serve as a gaming room, a movie room, a live sports room with get-togethers etc. I can put a bar there, framed posters, the sound will be better, the room will be air tight and completely light-less, and the wiring and decor can be what an HT room needs it to be. 

It's like a weight has been lifted. Sure, I might end up spending a bit more, and I'll have to alter my room requirements now with the interior guys, but I believe the experience will be worth it. What do you guys think? 

 

Edit: The ideas are flowing already. I'm going to have the entry doors open like the doors on the Bat Cave™  

Edited April 22, 2018 by achilles

[Ram Dante]

Sounds like a perfect man-cave! You should get it done. 

 

[AtheK]

Great idea, it's always good to separate the two out if possible. Go for it. 

[achilles]

^Thanks guys. God Of War is taking up too much of whatever time I have left so updates have been stingy. 

Looks like the dedicated room won't happen. The HT guys are saying that they can make my room sound as good to nearly imperceptible levels as a dedicated room with just some treatments which will go with the room decor very well. So what made me change my mind again? 

 

1. Having this in my room will be supremely convenient.

2. I won't need to spend for another sound system for my room, and I do want a sound system in my room. 

3. The garage space is small, and the AV guys say that controlling sound will be a lot more difficult in this small a room, and with added furniture, fixtures and room acoustic treatments, the room will be  even smaller in width by 1 foot, and the carpets etc. will make the room feel stuffy. 

4. The ceiling height is really low and that won't be okay for social gatherings. 

5. My room is already doubling up as a hang-out place for entertaining with lounge seating, lights etc., and having an AV system like this will be a lot more usable, and fun. 

6. And this is the biggest one: I moved TV and HT system from the living room to my room temporarily for GOW, and boy, woof. It just doesn't get better. The laid back feel of playing in the bedroom is just so on point. I can place a recliner easily in the space and it is just going to work. Boy am I excited. 

 

Now for the HT update: 

I visited my two shortlisted systems again, for an extended demo. This time, I was a little high , and there's a reason. Being a little high moves my perception to superhuman levels, or atleast that's how it feels like to me. Once again, both systems were really close, and both systems excelled in different ways. 

James Loudspeaker was more musical, the Interstellar score made me go f**king NUTS! Although it lacks a bit in vocal clarity, it was just so darn good with other things, that that slight oversight could've been overlooked. Also, the subwoofers in this were insane. If you guys remember the helicopter scene in The Matrix, when the Helicopter explodes in the building and Trinity tarzans away, I have never noticed two small explosions in that scene in the building. It's a quick 1-2 pop-pop. I must've watched that sequence a hundred times, and yet, this was the first time I noticed two separate explosions in there. It was always one continuous splash earlier. This just blew me away (remember, I was high  ). 

 

With B&W, again, they didn't have the required speakers in stock, they hadn't arrived yet, but I wanted to demo this right after I'd heard the previous system, and the sound signature is pretty much the same for this range of B&W speakers, and I did not want to waste this high, so we went. 

What we sampled again, blew me the fukc away, for a completely different reason. We demo'd the B&W CT series, their custom in wall installs, and let me tell you, I have not heard better vocals even in PVRs. There was just this.. lightness to the sound, like it was wafting through the air, instead of falling on us. Every single word in the launch sequence of Interstellar was audible, which wasn't the case with JL, or even with B&W's other speakers. The best part though was that even with that level of vocal clarity, the musicality of the background score was't compromised at all. The scene where Matt Damon finally breaks his "character", and that whole thing where the score just rises, till Matt docks with the spinning ship, oh, man. I'd forgotten most of the movie, having watched it only once when it had come out, and this made me just want to go on with the film. Goddamn! It was 1030PM (they normally shut at 7 ) so we finally decided to get up and leave. 

 

These will stretch my budget a bit, but can be managed. Another demo remains, but the B&W CT series might just be it. Fukc I can't wait.

My next, and probably final demo will be a complete film in both set-ups. Any suggestions? Anything with a good mix of action and decent dialog will do. 

 

And now, back to GOW  

[ayush12ice]

Have you visited sight and sound?

[amigoatul]

13 hours ago, achilles said:

^Thanks guys. God Of War is taking up too much of whatever time I have left so updates have been stingy. 

Looks like the dedicated room won't happen. The HT guys are saying that they can make my room sound as good to nearly imperceptible levels as a dedicated room with just some treatments which will go with the room decor very well. So what made me change my mind again? 

 

1. Having this in my room will be supremely convenient.

2. I won't need to spend for another sound system for my room, and I do want a sound system in my room. 

3. The garage space is small, and the AV guys say that controlling sound will be a lot more difficult in this small a room, and with added furniture, fixtures and room acoustic treatments, the room will be  even smaller in width by 1 foot, and the carpets etc. will make the room feel stuffy. 

4. The ceiling height is really low and that won't be okay for social gatherings. 

5. My room is already doubling up as a hang-out place for entertaining with lounge seating, lights etc., and having an AV system like this will be a lot more usable, and fun. 

6. And this is the biggest one: I moved TV and HT system from the living room to my room temporarily for GOW, and boy, woof. It just doesn't get better. The laid back feel of playing in the bedroom is just so on point. I can place a recliner easily in the space and it is just going to work. Boy am I excited. 

 

Now for the HT update: 

I visited my two shortlisted systems again, for an extended demo. This time, I was a little high , and there's a reason. Being a little high moves my perception to superhuman levels, or atleast that's how it feels like to me. Once again, both systems were really close, and both systems excelled in different ways. 

James Loudspeaker was more musical, the Interstellar score made me go f**king NUTS! Although it lacks a bit in vocal clarity, it was just so darn good with other things, that that slight oversight could've been overlooked. Also, the subwoofers in this were insane. If you guys remember the helicopter scene in The Matrix, when the Helicopter explodes in the building and Trinity tarzans away, I have never noticed two small explosions in that scene in the building. It's a quick 1-2 pop-pop. I must've watched that sequence a hundred times, and yet, this was the first time I noticed two separate explosions in there. It was always one continuous splash earlier. This just blew me away (remember, I was high  ). 

 

With B&W, again, they didn't have the required speakers in stock, they hadn't arrived yet, but I wanted to demo this right after I'd heard the previous system, and the sound signature is pretty much the same for this range of B&W speakers, and I did not want to waste this high, so we went. 

What we sampled again, blew me the fukc away, for a completely different reason. We demo'd the B&W CT series, their custom in wall installs, and let me tell you, I have not heard better vocals even in PVRs. There was just this.. lightness to the sound, like it was wafting through the air, instead of falling on us. Every single word in the launch sequence of Interstellar was audible, which wasn't the case with JL, or even with B&W's other speakers. The best part though was that even with that level of vocal clarity, the musicality of the background score was't compromised at all. The scene where Matt Damon finally breaks his "character", and that whole thing where the score just rises, till Matt docks with the spinning ship, oh, man. I'd forgotten most of the movie, having watched it only once when it had come out, and this made me just want to go on with the film. Goddamn! It was 1030PM (they normally shut at 7 ) so we finally decided to get up and leave. 

 

These will stretch my budget a bit, but can be managed. Another demo remains, but the B&W CT series might just be it. Fukc I can't wait.

My next, and probably final demo will be a complete film in both set-ups. Any suggestions? Anything with a good mix of action and decent dialog will do. 

 

And now, back to GOW  

Try Avatar/The Dark Knight rises/Finding Nemo for good AV performance.

[achilles]

2 hours ago, ayush12ice said:

Have you visited sight and sound?

 

Yeah, the B&W demos happened at S&S only. 

 

2 hours ago, amigoatul said:

Try Avatar/The Dark Knight rises/Finding Nemo for good AV performance.

 

Thanks. Don't like the first two, so might just use Nemo, though I was thinking more along the lines of Saving Private Ryan, or some other war movie, with lots of ambient sounds and dialog. Though I don't remember if SPR had a good background score? On the other hand, Nemo could serve as a good test for the projector too. 

 

Edit: How's Hateful 8? I haven't watched it so I'll be going in blind, which could be a good thing. 

Edited May 10, 2018 by achilles

[amigoatul]

 

1 hour ago, achilles said:

 

Yeah, the B&W demos happened at S&S only. 

 

 

Thanks. Don't like the first two, so might just use Nemo, though I was thinking more along the lines of Saving Private Ryan, or some other war movie, with lots of ambient sounds and dialog. Though I don't remember if SPR had a good background score? On the other hand, Nemo could serve as a good test for the projector too. 

 

Edit: How's Hateful 8? I haven't watched it so I'll be going in blind, which could be a good thing. 

Hateful 8 is very good to look at. Shot on 65mm film, colors are very natural and the audio track is no slouch either with blizzards and pump-action shotguns going off.

Edited May 10, 2018 by amigoatul

[VelivolusDas]

Not sure how much this will help in your situation @achilles, but....

 

https://gadgets.ndtv.com/tv/news/benq-tk800-dlp-4k-hdr-projector-launched-in-india-price-specifications-1850402

[ayush12ice]

7 hours ago, achilles said:

 

Yeah, the B&W demos happened at S&S only. 

 

Oh ok... i haven't properly followed your A/V hunt... How far along are you in it? Have you purchased anything yet? 
What all have you shortlisted till now? 

 

 

 

[achilles]

25 minutes ago, VelivolusDas said:

Not sure how much this will help in your situation @achilles, but....

 

https://gadgets.ndtv.com/tv/news/benq-tk800-dlp-4k-hdr-projector-launched-in-india-price-specifications-1850402

 

Thanks, will check this one out. 

 

12 minutes ago, ayush12ice said:

 

Oh ok... i haven't properly followed your A/V hunt... How far along are you in it? Have you purchased anything yet? 
What all have you shortlisted till now? 

 

 

 

 

[achilles]

Ho, hey. Time for a small update. So I took demos in Mumbai too, but who are we kidding? Bombay is a small market for these systems, numbers wise. Most people live in apartments where even a portable bluetooth speaker might cause problems. So, back to my two shortlisted systems in Delhi, JL & B&W. Also, this time I took The Social Network blu-ray alongwith

 

I spoke to the JL guys and was about to go for my final demo, and would've finalised this system with this, but those idiots removed that system and are installing a new, lower spec system from a different brand. I asked him if could've called me atleast once to tell me that they were going to do this, and I could've made the time earlier. Alas, this was on the top of my list, but I'll have to wait for my final demo since there's another demo room that's being set up in Bombay, but that's going to take a few weeks to complete. I just can't forget the melody these speakers gave me with Interstellar's BG score. Goddamn. 

 

For B&W, I went for a demo on Saturday, and that day was a complete waste of time. There were power outages, other clients interrupting, and other sh*t going down. Couldn't get a single demo properly, and I didn't even get to my music. Gah. Lesson learnt: never go for demo's on weekends. 

 

The Mumbai demo was pretty decent, but not enough to make me forego JL. Still, we heard a few Klipsch speakers and while they were pretty darn enjoyable for music, they faltered terribly for movies, and specially the mid range. 

 

There was another demo in Mumbai, with Meridian speakers, but it's not even worth the time I'd take to type on this. 

 

Gah. What is going on. Here, finally, I'm ready to get stuff done, with money in hand, and I'm not able to say confidently on one system, ONE, "this is it".  

[hope]

Not exactly home theater i want but want a good speaker.

 

Is F&D a good company? After sales all right?

 

Can anyone suggest a decent speaker. Budget is 1500 max. 

 

Couldn't find a thread for this