The Coronavirus Thread Part 2

[Right]

8 minutes ago, KunjanPSD said:

Weren't you the one who was lobbying against Pfizer, calling it a Big-Pharma monopoly, going against their request for indemnity?

You were very vocal about how you should have a right to sue them in case something goes wrong.

In that case, why didn't you just trust the men-of-science, the experts, the people who actually worked on the vaccine? Why didn't you take their opinion that the vaccine is safe? 

Because acc. to you, quite clearly we don't have enough time for data to be published and peer reviewed so similarly we didn't have enough time to get into political intricacies? 

We should have directly approved them.

 

What will you do if this drug ends up not working or killing someone over a long period of time? You'll do nothing and your govt. will give a smack to you if you try to.

 

You were so quick to call out that vaccine isn't working even after the data being out but noooo, inject this new drug right into my veins because we f**king don't have time.

 

Yeah, right. Give me a break.

I was simply against Pfizer because they have acted like an a*s. Their vaccine is probably the most advanced, right there with moderns but they sullied their reputation by asking for sovereign indemnity everywhere and when they were denied they shamelessly asked for collateral. 
They skipped 3 meetings with GoI, citing that they don’t have no one working in Indian time zone and finally pushed for getting approvals w/o trials.

At that point they were asking too much abd GoI had several misgivings about their position wrto being Pharmacy of the world.

Even after getting blainket approval they still want indemnity.

There reason is inexplicable if not suspicious, company as big as Pfizer should be having an army of lawyers, why they don’t take in their chin, like every other manufacturer out there?

 

Will I take Pfizer if I get a chance?  no second thoughts, I will.

But I like their way of dealing, no I don’t.

 

Its like Xbone with it’s DRM which they removed, many ppl would’ve still bought it but wasn’t it dick to think of your consumer thieves?

 

[Right]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Comingle said:

Smoking 2 packs of cigarettes twice a day prevents cancer. 

Source: I smoke 2 packs of cigarettes twice a day and I don't have cancer. 

Trust me because I am an expert. I am an expert in accounting and finance but don't let that deter you from your blind faith. 

Are you Dr Reddy?

or a scientist in DRDO’s drug lab?

are you even Baba Ramdev?

 

I will totally trust you, if you are.

Will not even ask you P1/P2/P3, leave alone peer-review or publishing, god promise.

[Maximus]

9 minutes ago, KunjanPSD said:

I trust Coronil to cure Corona.

 

7 minutes ago, Mr. Comingle said:

Smoking 2 packs of cigarettes twice a day prevents cancer. 

Source: I smoke 2 packs of cigarettes twice a day and I don't have cancer. 

Trust me because I am an expert. I am an expert in accounting and finance but don't let that deter you from your blind faith. 

 

 

[KunjanPSD]

3 minutes ago, Maximus said:

 

 

 

Bhagwan se bus thoda dheeraj manga tha, usne toh puri jholi bhardi.

[KunjanPSD]

[Right]

8 minutes ago, Maximus said:

 

 

 

Yeah, I already explained that Giloy and Neem are used to treat Pneumonia and Asthma. Ashwagandha has multiple benefits related to immunity.

 

Patanjali published their research about 2DG compound before DRDO made their drug.

 

Lets not go dissing Ayurveda, just because Ramdev runs gimmicks around it. He had done great disservice to it and I hate him for that.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Right

[Right]

2 minutes ago, KunjanPSD said:

make better arguments

be flexible to change

debate

accept

 

Good night.

[Right]

22 minutes ago, Mr. Comingle said:

The problem is that some people just have this urge to be right, to feel intelligent about things they don't know anything about that they abandon all critical thought and just healthy skepticism employed by any sane educated person. 

Problem with people is that they aren’t ready to accept the defeat, we have come long way from “using untested drug on 1billion people” to “I refuse to be Guinea pig”

Let’s continue after few days.

 

Let sone gora give validation and then we will find some other place to play peekaboo once again.

[Right]

Just now, Mr. Comingle said:

Haha nice attempt at deflection. 

Go back and search the same words in this very thread.

[Right]

Just now, Mr. Comingle said:

There is no question of accepting defeat because this isn't a competition. I'm just trying to educate you or at the very least delegitimise any nonsense you might try to peddle in the future. 

Dr Reddy are total chu*s who are investing in some nonsense drug.

Damn, they should totally come to this forum for some sound asswhooping they deserve.

 

I think you need a break.

I  surely do.

[KunjanPSD]

Glenmark invested in Favipiravir.

Zydus did in Virafin.

Hosts of companies did in Remdesivir, Tocilizumab, Itolizumab.

 

And here we are now saying that these drugs mostly don't work. DRL isn't any different.

Edited May 17, 2021 by KunjanPSD

[Right]

Just now, Mr. Comingle said:

I would have taken a break but sadly your opinion is worth less than the second rate dabeli sold near the traffic signal across my building. 

Dabeli is a sh*t dish anyway.

Dont get high on it.

[KunjanPSD]

2 minutes ago, Mr. Comingle said:

Tbf investing in stuff that fails isn't a bad thing. That's how science works. That's how any kind of innovation works. 

I completely agree. A company of that size invests in hundreds of molecules and drugs, I was just refering to the comment that just because a company like DRL invests, doesn't mean it's gonna be significant.

 

I am just amused that neither one of us is actually questioning whether the drug will work or not, it can surely do, the simple act of demanding documentation is hurting experts over here.

[Bird Bird Bird]

9 minutes ago, Right said:

Dr Reddy are total chu*s who are investing in some nonsense drug.

 

It's called business. Some pharma companies have made historical numbers during this time, all with drugs that don't work. Do a spotty trial, publish, get EUA, media picks it up and markets it. Later the researchers say it doesn't work, but people lap it up anyways. 

How do we know this ? Let's look at IQVIA's April 2021 data:

 

 

Fabiflu, which does not work (as stated via multiple trials), still leads to this:

 

 

The other companies (including DRL) have earned millions via RemD injections. And we know they don't work. 

 

 

People are sh*t scared. All top drugs are invariably related to COVID or complications. 

Market has shown that as long as you can show that your drug works, delay publications by 3-4 months, DCGI approves it as EUA because they really don't give a f**k at this point, the company will make bootloads of cash. 

 

Zydus launched Virafin. Look at the data - utter rubish piece of garbage. Their trial design, their primary end points, their calculations, all are extremely scummy. 

 

I really don't know the data on 2DG since everything is under wraps (since ICMR is a part of it, they could've easily shared baseline results with inclusion/exclusion criteria, methodology, scales used etc on a government portal till the time a peer reviewed publication comes along. Or just push it as non peer reviewed pre print, but nothing. It's super opaque). 

Their data can be the next coming of Jesus or a shitty trial like that of Glenmark and Zydus. Again, we don't know, and won't know till a publication comes out of it. What I do know if whatever they have released so far (via media) does not look like good data. They haven't clarified their primary end points. The 42% vs 31% argument can be demolished in an instant by looking at demographical data and method of analysis. 

Again, it can go either ways, but for those who do CTs day in and out, the scantily released data just does not smell of a decent ethical CT. 

 

[PS Fan]

2 hours ago, North said:

 

No offense dude, but hear me out. We've been in lockdown for like a month, and the maid hasn't come in since. We've been doing the work ourselves.

 

I totally understand your point, and even if maid was allowed in my society we wouldn't call right now. But it is f**king difficult cuz there are a lot of chores on top of regular office work for my parents and school for me. 

My mom has a comorbidity condition and hasn't gotten her second jab yet or we could call.

We're dependent on maids for good reason. There are people in my society who are old and can't manage all the cleaning and cooking and god only knows other household chores. 

 

Again, this virus is hitting much worse than 'inconvenience of not having a maid' so I will not speak any further. I hope everyone stays safe, that is more important.

Bhai agar tu US mein hota aur teri family  ki same situation hoti toh tu wahan maid rakhta??

 

Nothing is more important than safety of your family. Unless you have taken both doses of vaccine, allowing maid is too risky imo. 

 

Hospitals are overwhelmed and we all heard and seen the horror stories.  Couples in my neighbouring society Mahagun were admitted in  hospital coz of  their maid who had covid, she infected child first and within 2 days everyone got infected. They were safe all this time but moment they allowed maid back they all got covid.

 

Rest upto you. Imo only vaccinated people should allow maid till cases go down 

 

[PS Fan]

1 hour ago, djdgr8 said:

It unfortunately is because other people of the house won't lift a finger to help the ladies.  And when you have a lot of people living in the house I can imagine the work becoming unmanageable for 1 person.

I know. But still doesn't justify calling maid right now. Get vaccinated 1st then call maid

[AtheK]

Not sure of this was posted here, but do give it a watch. It is very well explained.

 

 

[Right]

8 minutes ago, Bird Bird Bird said:

. 

Again, it can go either ways, but for those who do CTs day in and out, the scantily released data just does not smell of a decent ethical CT. 

 

I trust your opinion about this and respect logical reasons to seek data.

 

But my point has been very different, elite commoners need to change the approach towards validation of findings.

It won’t happen so quick but eventually it would. And since time is too precious for us to miss the shot.

There are so many drugs being tried out, most of them repurposed, had no proper CT. People run around for vilas of Remdesivir,  spending wads of cash, despite being proven ineffective against Covid in various studies.

Why can’t we once accept a drug like 2DG, because it’s Desi? Because it made by a govt lab?

 

 

[PS Fan]

 

 

 

[Bird Bird Bird]

Just now, Right said:

Why can’t we once accept a drug like 2DG, because it’s Desi? Because it made by a govt lab?

 

No. We have burnt our hands with this before. Favipiravir, RemD, Toci, plasma. 

 

Everything has proven to be ineffective AFTER adequate trial. The pilot studies all claimed to have efficacy. 

 

A simple reason is any CT has vested interests, from the sponsor to the PI to all others involved in it. To ensure that data is not tainted, and adequate checks and balances have been maintained, it is published for the world read, comment, applaud or criticize. 

I agree that we cannot wait for peer review at this time, but basic data points should be posted via ICMR or MoHFW. The biggest challenge is that we know absolutely NOTHING about the data being touted. Most such trials use a very subjective scale for "cure", and are prone to severe investigator biases. 

 

Statistics has the power to make your poop a miracle cure, and hence we need to look at all aspects of the trial. Without that, it's he said she said. Bears no scientific credibility.